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Euro Crisis to Set One World Currency?

Friday, May 28, 2010 – by  Staff Report


Is Europe heading for a meltdown? ... This financial crisis is worse than the sub-prime crash of 2008 because the sums are so much bigger and it is governments that are in dire straits. Edmund Conway explains the dangers. Mervyn King, the Bank of England Governor, summed it up best: "Dealing with a banking crisis was difficult enough," he said the other week, "but at least there were public-sector balance sheets on to which the problems could be moved. Once you move into sovereign debt, there is no answer; there's no backstop." In other words, were this a computer game, the politicians would be down to their last life. Any mistake now and it really is Game Over. Or to pick a slightly more traditional game, it is rather like a session of pass-the-parcel which is fast approaching the end of the line. – UK Telegraph

Dominant Social Theme: The wise men of Brussels and the courageous citizens of the EU will muddle through.

Free-Market Analysis: As the money crisis seems to grow worse in Europe, we have begun to wonder if there are parallels to the 1907 financial panic in the United States that gave rise to the Federal Reserve. The dominant social theme way back then (assuming an active power elite, and we do) was along the lines of "The US banking system is too fragmented and a lender of last resort is badly needed." JP Morgan assembled his rich friends in the library of his exquisite New York mansion and bailed out the market, but only six years later, the Federal Reserve was born, the bastard child of false market-insolvency rumors and a knobby-nosed father (Morgan, himself).

There is, in fact, still speculation today that Morgan's camp planted the initial rumors of instability that swept the market and triggered the crash of 1907. Why on earth would he do such a thing? To generate the eventual result: the creation of the Federal Reserve and its passage by the US Congress. This is one perspective, anyway, the "paranoid one" that you will not find in most mainstream history books or college texts.

Back to our larger theme. We have written in the past (see – IMF Plotting Gold Backed SDRs) that we did not see how on earth the power elite was going to get from fairly abstract monetary concepts like SDRs to an actual worldwide consensus for a more globalized currency  (and a global warming – "carbon" – currency seems, as well, to be a non-starter, at least currently). In fact, we have speculated that the elite could decide on a gradualist approach, setting up a thesis/antithesis dialectic between global money and regional money to move the conversation gradually in the direction of a worldwide currency. But perhaps there is a faster way. Let us see ...

The European financial crisis started with Greece and, it's true, Greece's problems are moderate ones for the EU given its size and amount of debt. But this crisis has not been resolved despite the supposed US$1 trillion that has been set aside to discourage "wrong way" speculation in Greek debt. We saw yesterday that the larger market was up because of statements from Chinese leaders that they were not going to sell euros and were perhaps to continue to be a net purchaser. So this is what market confidence has come to: China, a rigid, neo-communist state with a raging property inflation problem is seen by "the market" as a lynchpin of the Western capitalist system. What a hoot. You can't make this stuff up.

Anyway, from our perspective, a hypothetical path to a world currency (with some speed) would involve certain very specific elements. It would include, obviously, a very serious sovereign wealth crisis spreading from country to country thoughout at least the Southern half of Europe. This crisis, hypothetically, would be averted by heroic Brussels bureaucrats but not before a significant amount of financial pain was inflicted – good and hard as H. L. Mencken might say. It might even involve the dissolution of the euro and the shrinking of the EU itself. But the pay-off for the power elite would be the ability to float a scenario that proposes a worldwide currency to avert additional difficulties going forward. Here's some more from the article excerpted above:

Strip away the details – the breakdown of the euro, the crumbling of the Spanish banking system to take just two – and what you are left with is the next leg of a global financial crisis. Politicians temporarily "solved" the sub-prime crisis of 2007 and 2008 by nationalising billions of pounds' worth of bank debt. While this helped reinject a little confidence into markets, the real upshot was merely to transfer that debt on to public-sector balance sheets.

This kind of card-shuffle trick has a long-established pedigree: after the dotcom bust, Alan Greenspan slashed US interest rates to (then) unprecedented lows, which helped dull the pain, but only at the cost of generating the housing bubble that fed sub-prime. It is not so different to the Ponzi scheme carried out by Bernard Madoff, except that unlike his hedge fund fraud, this one is being carried out in full public view.

The problem is that this has to stop somewhere, and that gasping noise over the past couple of weeks is the sound of millions of investors realising, all at once, that the music might have stopped. Having leapt back into the market in 2009 and fuelled the biggest stock-market leap since the recovery from the Wall Street Crash in the early 1930s, investors have suddenly deserted. London's FTSE 100 has lost 15 per cent of its value in little more than a month. The mayhem on European bourses is even worse, while on Wall Street the Dow Jones teeters on the brink of the talismanic 10,000 level.

It is obvious that the sovereign crisis can inflict considerable pain. And it seems to have just begun. Yet perhaps our scenario is too simplistic, too conspiratorial. We ourselves have maintained that the problems with the EU and the euro are probably in excess of whatever the elite had expected – and they did expect a crisis of this sort, one that was supposed to drive the EU into a closer political union. The idea, however, that the power elite could engage in cold-blooded manipulations of whole countries is fairly difficult to countenance. On the other hand, there are historical speculations that JP Morgan, at the height of his wealth, controlled in some sense up to half of the profitable enterprises in the United States. Wealth can be concentrated and great wealth begets wealth, especially because the current fiat money system that tends to collapse the middle class.

Assume somehow that the unrolling sovereign crisis is indeed a prelude to a fear-based promotion seeking a worldwide currency (and perhaps some sort of worldwide central bank to go along with it) and one begins to see the outlines of an especially audacious dominant social theme. Perhaps this theme would be buttressed with other fear-based promotions – local and regional wars, even confrontations that utilize small nuclear devices.

We're just speculating here, of course, for our window on power elite activities extends only to a modest comprehension of how elite promotions might operate. Yet even in stating this, we should also point out that these themes are promoted by a vast array of institutions – media properties, think tanks, NGOs and assorted non-profits, not to mention governmental entities. To accept the idea of dominant social themes is to accept that the elite has tremendous influence worldwide and especially in the West. We're past that point of course. We do accept it.

We would also point out that to try to force the issue now of a truly global currency would be audacious in the extreme. Citizens of the Anglo-American axis are up in arms over the poor economy and Europe is smoldering as well. Never has a sociopolitical awakening swept the West as it has now – courtesy of the Internet and its continual truth-telling. There is more and more anger over central banking, the West's serial wars, the over-taxation and the general dysfunction of regulatory democracy.

Does what we have proposed skirt the fringes of reality? If the powers-that-be were ready to tolerate a protracted series of sovereign crises in Europe – and it may be there is not much more to arrange -- alongside perhaps some unsettling wars, it might be possible to traumatize citizens of the West enough to make them amenable to global solution. This solution in our estimation might include the return to some sort of gold standard, but unfortunately not a market-based one. The elite would try to insist on a standard that it could in a sense control and continually manage – at least in our opinion.

Conclusion: All this is no doubt far fetched. But the Panic of 1907 and the subsequent erection of the Federal Reserve – if one accepts the relationship between the two – provides us with a template for the same sort of manipulation on a bigger scale (assuming one believes in the possibility of JP Morgan's market manipulations). However it is also true that this article itself is evidence of the difficulties that the elite would face in implementing the kind of program we have suggested. After all, if we are able to anticipate it, it has occurred to others as well. This is perhaps the elite's biggest challenge in the era of the Internet. It is most difficult to promote an audience, if it comes to that, aware of your intentions and the permutations of your strategies.

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Posted by Victor Barney on 5/28/2010 6:39:32 AM

It's only about setting up the "New World order" under Lucifer with a cashless society! Problem is? It's only going to last 3 1/2 years!

Posted by Jeff on 5/28/2010 6:58:19 AM

The meek shall inherit the earth ? The banksters egos must be getting fragile. I know the type its pitiful that you would think material rewards and power would make you happy . I'm sure they use one latrene at a time like the rest of us.

Posted by Cossack55 on 5/28/2010 7:49:53 AM

Actually, I have been obtaining One World Order currency for a number of years. It is buried and spoofed numerous places around the county. I assume we are talking about the pre-1933 OWO?

Posted by MarkC on 5/28/2010 7:55:17 AM

Far fetched? I don't think so.....

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 8:03:20 AM

'Mervyn King, the Bank of England Governor, summed it up best: "Dealing with a banking crisis was difficult enough," he said the other week, "but at least there were public-sector balance sheets on to which the problems could be moved. Once you move into sovereign debt, there is no answer; there's no backstop." '

Yes there is a solution, Mervin, just not one a central banker is likely to understand: Debtor bailout or if you prefer to be more traditional, debtor forgiveness (Deuteronomy 15:1-3) of the people you drove into debt slavery. Also, some compensation for the savers you cheated with negative real interest rates is in order too.

Posted by Dave Kress on 5/28/2010 8:29:21 AM

Excellent predictive &/or speculative report hitting many touchstones that are a gathering reality. One worrisome part is if gold is controlled pricewise by the power elite (post world currency adoption) and not by market forces then what is left to value anything? A two tiered black market would develop most likely with gold and silver going back into an underground
economy mode.

On JPMorgan, he probably created the 1907 Panic and with some deja vu in mind they are up to no good today by shorting the silver market! If he pulled it off in 1907 his minions will probably keep the lid on silver today along with FRS help to let the fiat money party continue.

May be time to sell silver as no one can beat Morgan--Not Congress, Not the markets. JPM continues to impugn our intelligence unabated. Silver should have exploded up to $25-30/oz. by now. The banks involved in this conspiracy cant be stopped. Keep up the great writing and forecasting of events.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Thanks, good point on a two-tiered gold market. Setting up a statist gold standard would likely only result in a gray or black market with "real" pricing. Ultimately, silver will find its real price, too, in our opinion. Market manipulations inevitably fail at some point.

Posted by Puzzled on 5/28/2010 10:03:56 AM

There was a Summit Meeting in San Francisco several years ago, that few people knew of. Can anyone out there give me a date? Because that meeting of all countries was on this new "One World Order" and Al Gore was there! I for one would like tobe certain of the discussions, one supposedly was "How many/who could have children. What kind of job/employment @ could have?

Posted by Bryan on 5/28/2010 10:10:37 AM

Gold and Silver is the best money money can buy. It is gaining power in spite of those who think paper is valuable because the ruling politicians say it is.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 10:24:06 AM

"Gold and Silver is the best money money can buy." Bryan

I've been reading "The Pragmatic Capitalist". That guy seems to really understand macro economics. He has convinced me that we are due for more deflation. Of course the government will attempt to spend US out of it so the question is "How?". My best guess is infrastructure. So, based on my current understanding I would:

1. buy US Treasuries
2. buy stock in large infrastructure building companies
3. or hold US dollars.

One must recognize that under our current system, fiat can be expanded to infinity but ONLY if people (or the government) borrow it. People are tapped out on debt and will be repaying it for a long time so the US dollar should get stronger.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 10:38:36 AM

"Contrary to popular opinion, government must spend before it can tax. Not vice versa. " from:

Click to View Link

Now this makes sense to me: "render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's ..." Matthew 22:17-22. This passage isn't about serving the government but simply returning what we have received from it (Caesar's money).

Posted by AmanfromMars on 5/28/2010 10:45:24 AM

"The idea, however, that the power elite could engage in cold-blooded manipulations of whole countries is fairly difficult to countenance." ..... Fairly difficult indeed , Daily Bell, although surely more widely known than ever before to be oh so too true.

However, nowadays, because it is not nearly as secret as it needs to be, for such a power elite to be able to continue in the same manner of the past in the future, is it [their rigged control system] therefore absolutely certain to collapse and to collapse increasingly quickly, with dire consequences for those players who have been cold-blooded and manipulative of whole countries ... unless of course, those self same players who proactively assist and fund the fix through new fixers/proxy players/remote champions.

It may be too much of an intellectual challenge for the disgraced incumbents to be able to handle the operations themselves, because of the deliberately obfuscated-for-advantageous-monopoly operation of the new technology leverage needed to deliver and ensure guaranteed success.

After all, to think that such as is the present condition would be in any way perfectly acceptable globally must indicate a pathologically perverse and severely damaged mindset which may be incapable of complete change.

Only the future will tell if such change is possible in such beings, and you would not expect any competent third party to share proprietary new methodologies which deliver such dividends to any who would be responsible for the necessity of emergency intervention and market takeover and makeover. That would be totally illogical and surely perfectly understandable to even the slowest witted of those who would have blown their position with such gross incompetence and arrogant disregard of collateral damage.

And it is a lot worse than even that, for there is a significant "mission creep" which it is as well for all to be made aware, so that those with both greater sense and resting money can make all necessary adjustments.

The following is shared elsewhere but it is always best to fully share advice on as many websites/information nodes as possible rather than just referencing to any particular and singular host, which may then disappear under a dedicated denial of service attack [DDOS assault] or server taledown, which is a lesson learned from experience in such matters.

And please bear in mind that what is shared is offered with whatever colour of hat you would care to wear other than a blackhat ... for from white through all the colours of the rainbow to whatever shade of gray, allows one to play magnificently in ZerodDay Virtual Trades.

[quote] Posted by: amanfromMars | 05/28/10 | 12:43 am |
Your comment is awaiting moderation.

"Posted by: CensoredByWiredScience | 05/27/10 | 10:32 pm |

Wow, a government owned and controlled remote access trojan. Yeah, no thanks."

Actually, CensoredByWiredScience, all such services are invariably privately owned and controlled and leased/loaned to government[s]. They are most certainly always developed privately and under the strictest of secretive security measures for Cyber Security failings are more catastrophically devastating and more costly to foe and/or competitive opposition than any conventional military campaign or nuclear blast can ever be, and much simpler to launch from areas deep within home territories which makes effective traditional defense against such sorties, impossible, although that has already been been recognised, which is heartening. Such then dictates that irregular and unconventional is the Future Norm Phorm.

"The U.S. is nearing total reliance on the integrity of cyberspace. This trend is irreversible. A small number of people, states, and organizations can manipulate cyberspace with devastating effect. The expense of cyber intrusion prevention systems is very high and can never be completely effective because the identity of the threat cannot be determined with a high degree of certainty.

For the immediate future, unless there is a technological breakthrough, society must adapt to the new realit - that cyber threats are inevitable and pervasive. The new phenomenon is that nefarious actors can cloak their identities in virtual worlds and operate freely with relative impunity." ....

Click to View Link

Indeed, it may even be more perversely pervasive and subversive than even that, for a malicious* non-state actor in such as are SMART Intellectual Property fields, would be totally invisible and intangible and have no need of a cloak.

The best that can be hoped for those circumstances is that they decide to work with you and for you rather than against you with a very helpful and accommodating competition.

* One man's malice is another man's beneficence ... and that is a subjective personal judgment call dependent upon one's level of intelligence and state of mind, which makes things even more difficult, and some would even say, impossible, to predict, however if one can supply what is needed without it causing concern, is malice always defeated by positively reinforcing mutual benefit and a well founded and growing stronger trust.

And with regard to "Yeah, no thanks." whenever the services are invariably privately owned and controlled and leased/loaned to government[s] and as described above, you might like to consider that there is no free choice to decline in the matter, only great opportunities to actively engage and participate directly in unfolding future events ....... which is surely the sweetest and stickiest of offers/honey traps to refuse and live to regret.

Click to View Link

And displayed in red because the information which was freely submitted was, for whatever reason you may care dare imagine, deemed unsuitable for greater collective global viewing. [/quote]


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Thanks for the links. Interesting.

Posted by H L Quist on 5/28/2010 11:05:31 AM

Does the Greek tragedy set the stage for the WOCU--World Currency? The timing of the failure of the USD and the Euro would be the opportune moment and much sooner than anyone might expect.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

We were going to mention the WOCU. It seems to be issued out of the" City" of London.

Posted by BETH on 5/28/2010 11:32:58 AM

I can see a global currency or similar being forced upon the people whether they accept it or not. Citizens rights are slowly but steadily being diminished even in the United States through laws that are being sneaked in in the middle of the night. When there are no more legal rights, then anything can happen namely a world currency as well as a world government

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 11:42:44 AM

You guys should check out Warren Mosler. This guy has real credentials with regard to money and finance and I like his solution to the debt crisis. Here's a sample: Click to View Link />
Please ignore the bad audio at the beginning it get better. This is Mosler talking at a Tea Party rally.

Posted by Mary Boud on 5/28/2010 12:03:56 PM

Many of us might welcome return to a gold standard but in our neck of the woods(the US), we have Progs in Congress (my new name for progressives)trying to discourage people from buying gold.

With what I've learned about the Club of Rome elitists, the UN cadre of madmen, and the Obama neo-Marxist oligarchy, I think gold ownership is seen as a potential threat to the development of the planned global currency they have in mind and which they would control, namely, 'carbon credits.'

Have you been hearing about Shore Bank and the Carbon Futures Exchange in Chicago (where else)? There've been snippets about it in the news because Shore Bank has been, or may be, purchased by another mysterious international entity. Just more evidence that control of carbon emissions has nothing whatsoever to do with the climate.

Instead of the term Progs, a friend of mine refers to the whole group of progressives, socialists, communists, Marxists, Maoists, fascists, corporatists, etc., as 'the Borg Collective.' The Borg were fond of saying, as they absorbed everyone they encountered on Star Trek, the Next Generation: "Resistance is futile." The good news is, the humans proved them wrong.

Posted by Ryan on 5/28/2010 12:08:10 PM

Real credentials? He's a "social credit" hack.

Click to View Link/

Click to View Link/

Posted by Bud Wood on 5/28/2010 12:12:02 PM

As you say, "the dissolution of the euro and . . . a scenario that proposes a worldwide currency".

In other words, a continental currency didn't work out, so we need a world currency!? Somehow that thinking doesn't seem to make much sense.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

None of it does.

Posted by Loren D. Waite on 5/28/2010 12:13:43 PM

HELP US ONCE AGAIN!!!

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 12:21:57 PM

"Real credentials? He's a "social credit" hack. " Ryan

Maybe so but his solution to bailout the debt slaves is sound and JUST.
I share your disdain for government solutions BUT the government got US into this mess via its support for the banking cartel; it dang sure can get US out of it. Otherwise we'll have pitiless, needless austerity that threatens world peace and does no one any real good.

Besides his solution is to repeal the Payroll tax which is about 16% of income (employer employee). Are you against tax cuts?

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 12:33:17 PM

Speaking of "hacks", our entire money system is unstable. Many assume that a return to gold and silver would fix the problem. Maybe so BUT maybe no. Thus I suggest an open mind on the topic. Plus, despite the insistence of many Austrians that we would have severe inflation, THEY HAVE BEEN WRONG. The CPI recently turned downward.

Many morally high sounding attitudes and platitudes about money are based on a imaginary money model and are irrelevant concerning what actually EXISTS.

Still, Mr Mosler might be a hack but at least his solution to the debt crisis is sound. That is better than what I have heard from the Austrians so far. He deserve additional listening, IMO.

Posted by Snowman on 5/28/2010 12:39:33 PM

"The idea, however, that the power elite could engage in cold-blooded manipulations of whole countries is fairly difficult to countenance."

Once again, it appears things are progressing according to "PROTOCOL".

Posted by Weeble on 5/28/2010 1:36:27 PM

Mefears that matey Fatbeard, is bound for Mordor, and he hath not a gold ring to guide him.

Post-Austrian? That's as wacky as me saying I'm a Logical Positivist! But I said it with tongue in my cheek at the time. I have soeme backpeddling to do myself. Backwards.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Fekete calls himself a neo-Austrian. Have doubts though ...

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 1:49:46 PM

"Post-Austrian? That's as wacky as me saying I'm a Logical Positivist!" - Weeble

The Austrians understand the unjustness of FRL yet their only solution is merciless liquidation. Now ideally banks, debtors and savers would all have taken a haircut to discourage future recklessness and to deflate debt to market levels. But that hasn't happened. Banks are being bailed out with a risk-free carry trade from the Fed to the Treasury and savers will be bailed out by the FDIC if necessary. That leaves the poor debtors losing their overpriced (driven up via FRL) homes. Should those homeowners have tried to save at pitiful interest rates while the cost of housing left them behind?


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Merciless Liquidation.

Translation: free markets.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 2:13:25 PM

"Mefears that matey Fatbeard, is bound for Mordor, and he hath not a gold ring to guide him." Weeble

Hopefully not Mordor but without a golden ring, true. And remember, Frodo's task was to destroy the Ring. Now, to the extent that central banks own huge amounts of gold and I hate central banks then yes, I wish to destroy the worship of that metal in the World. How? By advocating civilized alternatives. However, we may be too barbaric for civilized alternatives so owning gold is a prudent diversification.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 2:36:25 PM

"Merciless Liquidation.

Translation: free markets." DB

True. But we don't have that and haven't since 1913 at the latest. A truly free market would limit leverage to about 2-1 according to Rothbard, not 40-1 as is typical these days. Since we are bailing out the banks then justice, not mercy, requires that the savers and debtors be bailed out too. It's only money, mere book-keeping entries. As long as it is justly distributed then no one should complain.

Posted by Lysander on 5/28/2010 3:10:14 PM

I'm curious how a single world currency and central bank would work. The FED or the ECB or any central bank works because it is in partnership with the government. The government can enforce the cartel rules for the member banks and can make favorable monetary laws (legal tender law, capital gains tax on gold or silver, laws favoring big banks over small, etc.)

Without a world government, there can be no world central bank. And I don't think we are anywhere close to a world government.

Of course, a single currency would be possible...assuming it was gold or silver, but I don't think our shadowy overlords will go for that.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

It could be quite simple in our humble opinion. First you need a "tax" - which is why the UN keeps seeking a global tax. Then you need a "money" - already in place via the IMF SDRs. Then you need a crisis - sovereign ruin. Finally, you need a "government" on behalf of which to issue "money" - and a reason to do so ... You might not even need a "world government?' Either the UN or the IMF will do. Of course, we believe all this to be conspiratorial thinking and thus of little application to the real world ... or is it?

Posted by Lance E. Schultz on 5/28/2010 3:10:59 PM

"This is one perspective, anyway, the "paranoid one" that you will not find in most mainstream history books or college texts." -- DB

As I have stated before if such is proferred for "paranoia" then I hereby find myself guilty with no need for trial and I will wear and consider such "paranoia" as a badge of honor.

Please also keep in mind and verify for yourself when you have the time, that the seigniorage derived "profits" from the Federal Reserve are paid out 100% to shareholders of record at a rate of 6% on vested paid-in-capital only in the form of GOLD. Nothing else, but gold. For nearly one hundred years, each and every year, year-in and year-out, and last year alone $45 billion of U.S. gold reserves were permanently transferred and removed from the U.S. taxpayer to the shareholders of record for the private monopoly banking cartel and institutional criminal theft ring of the Federal Reserve rightly rebuked by Congressman McFadden, Congressman Charles Lindbergh and President's Andrew Jackson and Thomas Jefferson before it's inception. If the U.S. dollar was real why are such profits specifically prohibited from being paid-out in anything but GOLD?

Allow this Trojan Horse to continue to exact this heinous evil at your own peril, the peril of your children and grandchildren and the peril of your country. They are building a new financial world order in Basel Switzerland right before your very eyes.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

"For nearly one hundred years, each and every year, year-in and year-out, and last year alone $45 billion of U.S. gold reserves were permanently transferred and removed from the U.S. taxpayer to the shareholders of record."

Geez! Where is this documented, or is it? And what is the NWO you see being built in Basel?

Posted by Robc on 5/28/2010 3:11:39 PM

It does not make sense only if we look at the elite and project on them the love of wealth and power. That is a side effect, they really are a people who are pre-destined to create a world order based on their amoral way of life, many will be seduced by them, from 1000s you will only get one or two who will resist.

Globalization has largely homogenized the world's major cities, a global level playing field (what marxists call 'the race to the bottom'), where wage levels in the west are lowered to meet at a new lower level together with the 'third world', so the great mass of people are 'economic slaves', in debt, watched, their money totally controlled by a hidden elite. They are preparing for the arrival of their leader who will attempt to rule the world according to his godless rules.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 3:25:22 PM

"Please also keep in mind and verify for yourself when you have the time, that the seigniorage derived "profits" from the Federal Reserve are paid out 100% to shareholders of record at a rate of 6% on vested paid-in-capital only in the form of GOLD. Nothing else, but gold. " Lance

Oh goody! Now all we have to do is allow alternative currencies and leave the silly "shareholders of record" looking like barbarians as the price of their gold drops to mere commodity value.

The question is: Are we less barbaric than they?

Posted by Weeble on 5/28/2010 3:37:42 PM

@FB:

I can't go all Socratic on you today due to time constraints, but I do have a few minutes to pull over my Mini LB GT, and go a little Plato on you. The only reason I am doing this is because about 30 posts ago you said "I only want to learn and understand this" (paraphrased) in a seemingly exasperated tone.

Now, I do not profess to know anything in any great depth, but I do pride myself on good recollection. I am a humble chap really, but when you speak, I hear different words and thoughts and you get me going. Maybe I am incorrect, but after yesterday, I thought maybe you may have walked through the fur coats in the War Drobe, and entered Narnia.

I will repeat what you said, and then I will write what I heard.

The Austrians understand the unjustness of FRL yet their only solution is merciless liquidation. Now ideally banks, debtors and savers would all have taken a haircut to discourage future recklessness and to deflate debt to market levels. But that hasn't happened. Banks are being bailed out with a risk-free carry trade from the Fed to the Treasury and savers will be bailed out by the FDIC if necessary. That leaves the poor debtors losing their overpriced (driven up via FRL) homes. Should those homeowners have tried to save at pitiful interest rates while the cost of housing left them behind? - FB

The Austrians understand the unjustness of FRL and their solution is the same as always; liquidating the bad debt for a capital return to the lender. The lost capital is their punishment for poor lending practices. The defaulting borrower (debtor) is punished by denial of future borrowing and complete forfeiture of their assets, including no, no, no, not the Hummer, to the "man". If banks, debtors and savers would all have taken a haircut (with inflated dollars) to discourage future recklessness then the savers would have been the only victims.

Markets would have been distorted even further, as the savers cannot invest their lost money. It has gone; but where? The lost capital is spread amongst the banks and debtors who lent and borrowed poorly. They get to invest again. But that hasn't happened because we live in Narnia. It is winter all the time here. No respite from the cold.

Banks are being bailed out with fiat currency dollar for dollar with Fanny Mae / Freddy Mac toxic bad debt (almost zero value assets taken at sell price value), plonking that money back into the FED so the FED and banks' B/S (also called balance sheet) looks good. And just to add insult to injury, the banks get interest on their deposits! That leaves the debtors losing their overpriced homes because that is what the Ice Queen wants. Should those homeowners have tried to save gold while they rented housing?

Approach the Lamp Post please. The snow is melting, and I find the snowballs I am lobbing over have some stones in them at the moment.

Posted by Alan on 5/28/2010 3:49:30 PM

@ F.Beard

I resent how you attempt to monopolize the conversation in these comment sections, and continually interject your pro-government, anti-free market, statist monetary nostrums as the cure for statist economic and monetary failings.

Just as the truth is never the enemy of the good, I do not believe that coercion is ever the friend of the good, yet you continually advocate "just a little more" coercion as the remedy for the evils brought about by the initial coercion. Your political and monetary principles are profoundly muddled and conflicted.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

We have noticed this, too. We are happy to have Mr. Beard's comments, but a little more consistency (in either direction) would alleviate any doubts about his motives.

Posted by Chris F on 5/28/2010 4:06:29 PM

A one world fiat currency? As opposed to the failing national fiat currencies. Isn't the Euro collapsing because you cannot have a single monetary currency for countries that have different economic and fiscal policies? The Euro took 11 years to collapse, I'll give a new global currency not even half that. This sounds like a banker fantasy, totally unworkable in reality. The Elite should Retreat entirely, let's go back to gold and silver, add nickel and copper and for extra measure.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Sure, but central banking is collapsing in the US as well. All these systems are unworkable -- but it is the very collapse that provides opportunity. Out of chaos, order. Our point in the past has been that the elite did not comprehend the level of chaos, the truth-telling on the Internet, nor the level of anger that would aimed at their manipulations. Everything they are trying to do right now is compromised by incredible and unprecedented transparency. That doesn't mean they won't blunder ahead, however - hence our article.

Posted by f on 5/28/2010 4:08:11 PM

"If banks, debtors and savers would all have taken a haircut (with inflated dollars) to discourage future recklessness then the savers would have been the only victims. Markets would have been distorted even further, as the savers cannot invest their lost money. It has gone; but where? The lost capital is spread amongst the banks and debtors who lent and borrowed poorly. They get to invest again." @Weeble

Yes, bailing out the debtors would normally screw the savers via inflation (or lack of deflation). But apparently you don't hear me when I say the savers should be compensated too by forcing the banks to distribute the bailout money to all bank account on a pro-rate basis. So:

1. Debtors have their mortgages paid down to market prices with new Greenbacks.
2. Savers end up with those new Greenbacks in THEIR accounts.
3. The banks mark their loan assets down to market prices.
4. The banks end up with new high powered money as a new asset.

Winners:

1. Debtors.
2. Savers.
3. Banks (assets are now priced to market).

Losers:
1. the Banks in real terms
2. The whole concept of fractional reserve lending.

If FRL can be run forward to cheat savers and at the same time drive debtors into debt slavery then I say it can be run backwards to free the debt slaves and compensate the savers.

However, let's just drop the 15 % Payroll Tax as Warren Mosler suggests. Running FRL backwards is too incomprehensible it seems. That tax cut would benefit both savers and debtors and unfortunately the bankers too.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 4:35:49 PM

"Just as the truth is never the enemy of the good, I do not believe that coercion is ever the friend of the good, yet you continually advocate "just a little more" coercion as the remedy for the evils brought about by the initial coercion. Your political and monetary principles are profoundly muddles and conflicted." Alan

Sorry to get on your nerves. Sometimes I get on my own. I sure wish this and other blog sites had an ignore button so I would not have to be concerned about boring people. They could just push a button and be blissfully unaware of my comments. Moving on ...

First I am for a totally free market. However, we have not had one for a long time AND there are victims of the current system. Plus, there is the distinct possibility of a traumatized economy that we may not recover from for decades. So yes, I do advocate redress via government since government go US into this mess. After THAT then a free market, I say. First justice, then liberty.

As for being muddled, I am very principled. However there are alternatives solutions to problems that are equally principled but are conflicted with each other. Example: Should FRL be abolished or allowed without government privilege?

This is an Austrian site and I know I sometimes offend but believe me I used to be a fervent Austrian too. I am no less principled than any Austrian, but I can learn too.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 4:41:36 PM

"We are happy to have Mr. Beard's comments, but a little more consistency (in either direction) would alleviate any doubts about his motives. " DB

You are gracious and kind. I do appreciate it. As for consistency, it is just that the need for justice might outweigh my immediate desire for liberty. I am consistent if one remembers that.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

The issue is - whose justice? Human action shows us that justice is an immediate and personal affair, hopefully delivered via common law. The idea of "justice" in which the Fed or the US government provides "redress" to the "citizens of the United States" is from our point of view merely another manipulation - it will simply be a further chance to loot.

When large, faceless entities redress ills for other, large, faceless entities, the result is not, in fact, justice but the fulfillment of various types of back door self interest. So we would suggest "liberty before justice." One may be a possibility, the other merely an abstract principal in today's authoritarian environment.

Posted by Rodneycromwell on 5/28/2010 5:00:23 PM

Good grief! The problem is: central banking. creating wampum out of nothing. I don't care if the medium is gold, silver or seashells, just don't let the bankster/gangsters any where near it. At this late stage of the criminal enterprise of central banking I think the only reasonable thing to do is to DEFAULT. Oh, there'll be wailing and gnashing of teeth, but the pain will be short lived. If the US were to default, who would loan it money? That's right. What a blessing!

Posted by Weeble on 5/28/2010 5:07:42 PM

The one thing I like about this site is that it is full of diverse opinions and questions that need answers. Some listen and learn, others, not so much.

With respect the SDR, the May 13 video I saw recently with Niall Ferguson and the CFRites in DC basically explained that the sovereign nations' debt was out of control. Governments are big babies that keep suckling on the teet of the printing press, and it needs to stop. 6, whittled down to 3 pathetic solutions, then silence, then a Q&A jaw flap that was most impressive (gag).

The EU has a monetary union, but not a political union; then why not the IMF instead? They are the monetary white (no black) knights now. Let them ride in on an SDR chariot and save the day.

It's all very disturbing. But this is the fiat world we live in.

Look up septic shock on wiki.

Septic shock will de-oxygenate the system, with the blood of black markets and gold. Very simply put, the people in tent cities in the good ole USofA are off the grid or out of the matrix. They are the ones that have nothing to lose by going "cash" as they have nothing to lose.

The rest of us have to make our own decisions about how to proceed. Do you want your money back; do you want to continue to suck on that teet too, so you stay in the matrix? Or do you cut your losses and stay in the system just enough to pay the bills, and the fluff of your life is in cash, PMs and BMs?

But the matrix is not a circle, it is a helix. But hey, what do I know?


Reply from the Daily Bell:

You have a better stomach than we do to sit through that. Anyway ... agree to a point about diverse opinions. A broad tent does include Dogster, Mr. Beard, the Brownians, free-bankers and of course the economics of the Austrian school. We're not sure we'll ever attract many full-fledged Keynesians (if they still really exist).

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 5:20:39 PM

"So we would suggest "liberty before justice." DB

Of course in the long run, liberty WILL lead to justice (and maybe in the shorter run too). However, we are far from liberty. I am afraid if we won't use government to make some redress then we risk even less liberty in the future. Hitler came to power because of the Great Depression.

"One may be a possibility, the other merely an abstract principal in today's authoritarian environment."

No, there is little that is abstract about the difference between the market price of one's home and the amount he owes on it (I am debt free, BTW). That difference was caused by the unjust government backed banking cartel. Debt-free money could be created to eliminate that injustice.

Let me layoff till tomorrow. I fear I bore.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

We have actually written that there should be recourse for those defrauded because of the manipulations regarding gold and silver, mortgages, financial regulations, etc. It probably amounts to most if not all of the country. But we would urge forms of private- common law - justice. To use US domestic or international courts for such purposes would be to use the legal paraphernalia of the elite itself.

So we are still unclear as to what you propose and how you would going about implementing it. Eventually there WILL be some sort of movement along the very lines you are discussing. It will focus on, in our opinion, a broad gamut of individuals including the policing and military agencies of the US as well as elements of the political, financial, regulatory and legal class.

Posted by Mary Boud on 5/28/2010 6:03:45 PM

To Daily Bell - Well said. Liberty is second only to Life itself. Recall the unalienable rights of our Creator to all people -- Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness. Government's role is to secure those God-given rights, to preserve Justice.

Posted by Gunter on 5/28/2010 6:44:57 PM

I cannot shake off an eery feeling that something "big" is about to happen. Today, Fitch downgraded Spanish debt. One could percieve this as another salvo from an American rating agency towards an "enemy" currency.

But here at the Bell, we know better. The goalpoasts are being shifted truly and visibly, and I must agree with DB and other contributors that a "WOCU" (that's a first for me) may be or is being prepared. However, frightened people make wrong choices, and I feel that our Elite is frightened right now.

Critical mass is imminent. (Maybe tomorrow I will be frustrated again in thinking how it is possible that these *ssh*l*s can keep this sh*t going for so long because my mind is as volatile as the Dow lately.)


Reply from the Daily Bell:

A febrile mind is a good thing.

Posted by Jeff In USA on 5/28/2010 7:05:55 PM

Victor Barney said it is only going to last 3 1/2 years but he forgets that occurs after the man thinks he is the answer stands up in the rebuilt temple in Jerusalem and declares himself god. What about the other 3 1/2 years?

Posted by E Bannister on 5/28/2010 8:02:25 PM

To think that what is unravelling in Europe and yet to roast in the USA is the result of some form of mistakes or incompetence would be naive at best.

Just as JP Morgan managed to pull of in 1913 today's elites have the game playing right in to there hands. The only differencs is that there is far greater political savvy today and I feel we can see the elites getting edgey and hastening to culminate their agenda.

Revolution must come from the educated classes and it must come soon.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

It is too late for the elites?

Posted by Lila Rajiva on 5/28/2010 9:17:33 PM

@ F. Beard -

The trouble with the greenbackers is that their idea of "justice" applies only to people who got underwater on their homes, and other debtors, who are for the most part not innocent. Some thirty percent of those people were speculating in real estate.

The rest took out loans without any common sense. Getting indebted so badly that you can't pay back is much the same as theft.

The truly innocent who've been robbed are savers, and I don't notice that the greenbackers or "real bills" advocates want to help them. Instead, they too want to join the queue of people robbing the savers.

Bottom line: You can't get something for nothing. People lived vastly beyond their means, the rich and the poor, on the back of American and Asian savers. Now the bills are due, they don't want to pay, like any dead beat. It's as simple as that. The rich have bought the system and don't get punished. Now the "poor" (most are not really poor but profligate) want their share, by robbing the savers once more.

Furthermore, those who had their homes foreclosed on often don't have much in them to begin with. They can walk away, or have their mortgages adjusted. Or sell at a loss.

That doesn't sound too bad to me. Where is it written that you must own a house? Nothing wrong in renting, if you don't have what it takes to own. It's not a divine right.

When the stock market crashed, and investors lost, did the government foot the bill? If the government should pay off some people's mortgages, why shouldn't it make other people's car payments, school loans, medical payments and anything else?

I don't hear any contrition or shame from anyone at being debtors and not being able to make good their creditors.

That is very unworthy of the great, honorable republican spirit that built American.

Shame on the greenbackers.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Good points, Ms. Rajiva. But what about the people (we know some) who have lost their savings due to what appears to be gold and silver manipulation? What about the people who have lost everything - businesses and savings - due to the artificial booms and busts of the manipulated money system, courtesy of central banks? Do these and others deserve justice as well? Will they ever receive it? Is it even worth speculating on?

Posted by F. Beard on 5/28/2010 10:50:52 PM

"The truly innocent who've been robbed are savers, and I don't notice that the greenbackers or "real bills" advocates want to help them. Instead, they too want to join the queue of people robbing the savers. " Lila Rajiva.

Et tu Lila?

Actually Lila,

My proposal for running fractional reserve lending backwards would compensate savers too and pay down bank assets to market prices. Scroll up and verify if you please. I am concerned for justice. The only ones screwed by my proposal would be the banks who cheated savers out of honest interest rates while simultaneously driving folks into debt slavery via negative real interest rates in housing. Also, the banks would only be screwed in real terms not nominal terms. They would get their pound of flesh but not the blood.

As for speculators, Lila, what are people supposed to do for their retirements when the banks pay pitifully suppressed interest rates?

Sorry, I meant to wait till tomorrow to bore some folks but noticed Lila's attack and could not resist defending my honor, such as it is.

And now why I pursue justice before liberty (to The DB and not Lila)

"He has told you, O man, what is good;
And what does the LORD require of you
But to do justice,
to love kindness,
And to walk humbly with your God?" Micah 6:8

Truthfully, it would give me great satisfaction to see liberty alone bring about justice. I loath using the tools of government to bring about justice but justice is just. Those who have looted via government may be justly looted themselves by government to restore their victims. In fact, the Bible specifies a minimum of double repayment. I aim for only 1/2 of that.

But heck, Warren Mosler's idea of eliminating the 15 % Payroll Tax (employee employer) seems a lot more practical way to enable people to keep their homes. BTW, I am neither employed nor in debt so my proposal would not benefit me personally. In fact, my mother owns bank stock (bless her heart).

Posted by John Edwards on 5/28/2010 11:19:11 PM

One world currency, New world order. The power elite love us to use these names as they are terms that inevitably get turned around and thrown back at us prols. as straw man arguments. Statements of position that are difficult to define and even harder to argue against. That's because IMO we individuals are trying to fight a system that can hide its protagonists behind a wall of government and commercial secrecy thus avoiding, or at the very least, deflecting unwanted inquiry and diffusing outside attacks so as to render them impotent.

I live in Perth, Western Australia and believe me, government and Big business (ie. Mining, Oil and Gas.) are plundering the state leaving it's population fragmented and confused; just the way they like it. The USA and Europe may be centre stage but the collateral damage is hurting everyone except the power Elite, and they are getting quite conspicuous here in Perth.

I am convinced that we are one of the enclaves for the Super Rich in Western Australia as we are so isolated and docile to authority. One of the many down sides for Western Australia is that there is such a large and growing gap between the rich and poor - and merciless promotion of alcohol for all social events. Our night life has been turned into one of booze, noise, and arguments with violent outcomes.

Don't be fooled by what you hear about Australia, it is NOT a land of opportunity unless you pledge allegiance to the New World Order and work like a slave for over 14 hrs a day, 7 days a week in blistering 45 degree heat. And don't forget you can be sacked at any time with no notice and no rights of redress through the courts.

Come to think of it, we do already have a form of despotic rule in Australia. Great template for the coming MWO. The sheeple here know how to please the elite.
Anyway, I hope this little diatribe is not so far off the points being discussed here as to render it unworthy of inclusion.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

We are not fooled. We follow the Australian press and even its alternative press (such as it is). Australia may be even farther down the authoritarian road than Britain.

Posted by Weeble on 5/29/2010 12:24:35 AM

Since the people that witnessed first hand the 1907 panic are pretty well all dead now, we can only imagine their feelings of financial panic at the street level, leading to the feeling of helplessness when the Fed was created to solve the "problem".

When Zimbabwe's dollar went into orbit a couple of years ago, Gideon and Robert were helpless to stop the black market in USD and SA Rand from being used as currencies in their country. At least it stabilized transactions, so people could feel confident that a Zim$ was not 50 cents after they lined (queued) up all day at the bank to cash their cheque.

When Argentina's Kirchners recently nationalized the citizens' pension funds (savings) so they could use the capital and then pay only the interest every year, I would imagine the citizens were mighty ticked (as well as the bankers).

On a nice weekend in the summer of 2010, after the week from hell when the Spain and Italy bond market yields ballooned, and caused world markets to rapidly implode, the IMF stepped in.

They announced that due to the financial crisis, all currencies would have a pegged exchange rate to the SDR, which held its value nicely over the years. Here is the current peg list for the last 5 days, if it were to happen now:

Click to View Link

You see, the SDR never dropped in unison with the rest of the fiats, as it was not a currency. Canada, as an example was worth 62 cents compared to the USD back in early 2000s. Even though it is currently worth 64 cents compared to the SDR, it is worth 62/67=92 cents compared to the USD. That's about right for a Petro fiat.

Governments feeling the heat (from the Power Elite), and citizens feeling the pain (from the governments), welcomed relief from the stone-faced honest looking IMF faces; they are bigger than Ben! Once the peg was in effect for a couple of months, and the credit started flowing again (Power elite meth delivery program), the UK 2 man funny team said: "what a pain that a UK pound is always worth 1.5 USD. We need money at the top, I mean for the citizens; how about we devalue it to 1/1 with the USD by printing a bunch".

The IMF stepped in and said: "I am sorry, but you failed to read the fine print in the contract. The Pounds you have are the Pounds you work with. If you want to relieve the pain of the peg, use SDRs for your transactions. In fact, by 2012 you will be using them internally anyway. We have some printed up for you right now. Here, take these and hand in your Quids in".

The UK team looks at the pile of SDRs in the vault destined for the UK, and asks what the other huge pile was for. They said: "shut up and take your money". That was the point when the government types realized they now had no control over their money.

SDRs quickly became the currency of choice all over the world, as the pesky exchange rates were gone.

Then, after a few years, the IMF financial thumbscrews began to really tighten, and the government "managers" realized their folly, and how they lost their fiat. They try to join the resistance, but we would not let them in.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Ah, a monetary fable. Thanks.

Posted by Weeble on 5/29/2010 12:37:57 AM

Yes, I think my calling is logical positivistic fiction.

Posted by Mary Boud on 5/29/2010 12:47:30 AM

To Lila Rajiva, F. Beard, DB, et al -

Since there is a lot of blaming going on, I need to remind you that the U.S. housing crisis began with

a) corrupt legislators,

b) community organizers, and

c) unthinking social justice types.

The (c) group thought everyone had a 'right' to a home; the (b) group agitated the 'poor and entitled' and stormed the lobbies of banks and mortgage lenders to provide low or no interest loans; the (a) group made promises of entitlement in order to gain voters and pressured the lenders to make these unsecured loans.

After all, Fannie and Freddie ultimately buy up a huge percentage of mortgages and, since they are government entities, it didn't matter if they failed. The corrupt legislators said "Not to worry." The hard-pressed taxpayers would end up footing the bill anyway. The real culprit is any and all who give in to their baser natures. Corruption is rampant.

Posted by Weeble on 5/29/2010 1:04:20 AM

Since my fable was getting a little too wordy, I did not elaborate on the "resistance".

Suffice to say, the resistance will be the same as it is right now. People are loading up on gold, silver, other PMs and other real (tangible) assets, as well as navigating the system while trying to stay out of it as much as possible. Nothing violent in any way shape or form.

Posted by Michael Ponzani on 5/29/2010 1:18:14 AM

Very good article. The wonderment about J.P Morgan setting up the Panic of 1907 in order to create the Federal Reserve seems credible. I read the story of Jesse Livernmore. He shorted stocks during the panic and made about $100 million at that time, in those dollars! J.P. personally visited him in Livermore's office and told him not to short anymore stocks. He explained if Livermore shorted more stocks he would destroy the monetary system in place at the time and then "we wouldn"t be able to get anymore out of it."

This Federal Reserve, which most of the bankers were for, is the biggest scam in the world. Although they return much of their profits to the Treasury, their offtake enables them to buy lots and lots of stuff, while the stuff's ex-owners will be left holding the paper money bag. After all, the Feds and their favored cliques get the money first.

Gold and silver, with copper for the small stuff, were the original one world currencies. Incidently, everyone wants a weaker currency. This is short sighted. A strong currency means you own everything. I'd rather you worked for me than the other way around.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 1:24:16 AM

"Since there is a lot of blaming going on, I need to remind you that the U.S. housing crisis began with a) corrupt legislators, b) community organizers, and c) unthinking social justice types.
The (c) group thought everyone had a 'right' to a home; the (b) group agitated the 'poor and entitled' and stormed the lobbies of banks and mortgage lenders to provide low or no interest loans; the (a) group made promises of entitlement in order to gain voters and pressured the lenders to make these unsecured loans." Mary Boud

I'll say it again, socialism did not get a good start in the US till the fascist banking system ruined the economy in the 1920's and 30's. The fascists going back to Hamiltion are to blame since they assumed they knew what was best for the "common" man. Conceited, bigoted aristocrats who thought the world owed them a living are to blame.

Who knows what the population would be like if it hadn't been despitefully used all these years, given shoddy socialism paid for with some of their own looted purchasing power? Sorry, but the blame rests completely with those who have been in power. Sure, the poor may not be completely blameless but who is to judge them when they have been victimized by those who should have known better?

Let's not blame the victims, please.

As for the right to a home, it is 2010 and there is not yet enough accumulated capital in this country for every one to have a modest home? Just when is the future supposed to arrive?

Please don't buy into the hypocritical morality pushed by the bankers. Fractional reserve banking IS THEFT. The poor in particular are looted by it.

Posted by Clayton on 5/29/2010 3:42:55 AM

Many dittos to Lila Rajiva.

I am one of those savers, who has zero interest, which means that my principle is being taxed away to pay for the Bailout.

Thank you for your direct pronouncement on the evil committed and the class of people who are forgotten. If the Power Elite are successful, the Forgotten People will remain forgotten.

We, the Forgotten People, look about and see a huge number of folks who would be happy to loot our houses and drive off in our cars. If they were hungry enough, they might even go Donner Party and eat us. We are vastly outnumbered.

Our question is how to keep some of what we have, at least enough to survive on and hopefully enough to start over again when this crisis abates. It sounds like a simple enough task, but it is actually more complex than Higher Mathematics. Everyday, the rules change. In November, the faces may change also.

And, as Mary Boud has pointed out, these faces must answer to two groups above all else, the Power Elite and the Mob. Outside of Ron Paul, I have no hopes left that anyone will be listening to me and my concerns. I will have to accept it and make my adjustments accordingly.

In the future, perhaps you and I will be able to get together with enough other like minded folks and present sufficient mass to be taken seriously. I would like that. I live in the SF Bay Area (Southern Marin). Feel free to get in touch. But for now, it looks like the Greenbackers have the day.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Lila Rajiva is a deeply thoughtful person.

Posted by Adam Neira on 5/29/2010 6:20:58 AM

G-d is in control. The universe is stable, ordered, benevolent and expansive even if the minds of many bear witness to the opposite fact. All these perturbations are leading to the emergence of another paradigm...

Posted by Weeble on 5/29/2010 9:28:18 AM

I assume you did not watch the Niall Ferguson video I suggested, but he was touted as on the top 100 list of most influential people in the world. In my language, that would mean major meme mouthpiece.

I went to Youtube looking for that video again, but instead found a few other videos from him. His major thrust is that all sovereign debt is too high and cannot continue.

It plays right into my fable.

Any chance of including him on your list of near futuristic articles, or do you think he is just bending it like Beckham? I had never heard of him before a couple of days ago.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 11:53:05 AM

"We, the Forgotten People, look about and see a huge number of folks who would be happy to loot our houses and drive off in our cars. If they were hungry enough, they might even go Donner Party and eat us. We are vastly outnumbered. " Clayton

Ah yes, the poor savers who join the banks in looting the public risk-free (via the FDIC) and then wait around like vultures waiting for deflation so they (like the banks) can have some of the few remaining dollars left in the economy.

Sure, savers have been cheated via negative real interest rates but that same process was used to drive debtors into debt-slavery. Both savers and debtors have been cheated by fractional reserve lending.

Debtors and savers should not be at odds with each other. They are both victims of the banks and should be united against the current banking and money system.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 12:03:49 PM

[addendum to previous comment]

And contrary to banker propaganda, both debtors and savers can be bailed out.

An effective but crude mechanism would be to ban FRL and have the US Treasury give every family in the US the difference between the average mortgage principle owed in the country and the average market prices of those homes. That amount is approximately how much the economy is short of real money.

The bankers might howl but deflation would end and without FRL, inflation would not be a threat either.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 4:51:59 PM

"So we are still unclear as to what you propose and how you would going about implementing it." DB

What I propose is a just reset followed by true liberty in money creation. Folks were looted by money-from-nothing backed by legal tender laws and could be restored with legal-tender money too. However, the abolition of the Payroll Tax like Warren Mosler proposes is less controversial and would accomplish much the same thing. Surely the Bell supports tax cuts?

"Eventually there WILL be some sort of movement along the very lines you are discussing. It will focus on, in our opinion, a broad gamut of individuals including the policing and military agencies of the US as well as elements of the political, financial, regulatory and legal class. " DB

You intrigue me. Please elaborate?


Reply from the Daily Bell:

"What I propose is a just reset followed by true liberty in money creation. Folks were looted by money-from-nothing backed by legal tender laws and could be restored with legal-tender money too. However, the abolition of the Payroll Tax like Warren Mosler proposes is less controversial and would accomplish much the same thing. Surely the Bell supports tax cuts?"

This is your idea of justice?

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 5:14:46 PM

"I don't hear any contrition or shame from anyone at being debtors and not being able to make good their creditors." Lila

Come on Lila, you are a smart gal. Why not call creditors what they are, a government backed counterfeiting cartel? Banks create money from nothing and lend it out for interest that DOES NOT EXIST. That is USURY according to some regardless of the interest rate. Actually, traditional counterfeiters might do less damage since with them the only risk would be inflation, not deflation. But traditional counterfeiting is too obvious so fractional reserve lending was invented to replace it.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 6:20:32 PM

"This is your idea of justice?" DB

Then what would you suggest? I'm all ears.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Something that might help ...


--------------------
Click to View Link
--------------------

Posted by Bruce on 4/6/2010 12:25:52 PM

You get the same treatment from every aspect of the mercantile regime running this nation and almost every other nation on earth. Go to a county commission meeting and voice your concerns. The commission will listen, and then do what they damn well please.

Get kidnaped on the street or the nation's waterways by jack booted thugs in uniform carrying a badge. They bring you into an executive branch administrative court before someone called a judge, who is merely a clerk for the police agency who kidnaped you .

They pretend the whole thing is judicial, but it isn't. Then they ask you questions, like, 'What's your name? or 'Are you So and So? Let me ask you this, 'If whoever brought me here can't testify to who I am and why he brought me here, then by what authority do you hold me and ask me questions?

If asked, 'What's your name? my response is, 'What makes you think I have a name? You wouldn't believe how fast the hands come off from me. The word 'name comes from the Latin word 'Nome which means 'debtor.

The question, 'What's your name? actually is the question, 'Do you recognize me as the creditor so that I can determine how much money I can extract from you today?

There is no honesty in government. There is no law in the courts. That's why attorneys are designated 'at law rather than 'in law. That's why tax delinquent property is sold on the courthouse steps rather than in the courthouse. These people are operating outside the law " and they know it.

Did you know that the entry of a plea in court is a voluntary agreement to subject yourself to the court's jurisdiction? The word 'jure means 'rights. The word 'diction means to say or speak. Jurisdiction means to declare ones rights " to dictate rights.

Where does any court get the 'right to dictate rights " other than from those who voluntarily enter it praying for a remedy?Did you know that arraignment is the placing of your commercial interests upon the court's commercial ledger? Did you know that a court is synonymous with a bank?

A bank is a court. Look the terms up in Black's Fifth (or earlier) Law Dictionary.Why does an alleged Judge ask you any question? Have you given that any thought? Why doesn't he just say, 'Sit there, Shut up, and Do whatever you're told.?

The reason is that he needs your consent to be judged in order to shield himself and his criminal companions from civil and criminal liability. Without your consent, you could prosecute him for his crimes, and the crimes of the corporate police officers!

Executive administrative officers have no authority imposing their wills upon the people " whose law is the common law, while corporate administrative law is a foreign jurisdiction to these united States.

An officer who sees the commission of a murder or rape doesn't need a name to arrest and hold the perpetrator. No name need be given to try the perp before a jury, nor to convict and hang him.

These people operating in administrative law (executive branch) are operating a gigantic charade for profit. For that reason they need endless dialog as to how the mechanism is to be handled. The law thing they need is to get to the root of the problem, which is the absence of law.

Enter: The Restore America Plan. These people get it! These people have instituted a plan to restore the free republics. I just discovered them and their plan last night, and I am very encouraged and excited. Here are two links I have found to audio explanation of what they are doing:

First hour

Click to View Link/

Second hour

Click to View Link/

Here's a link to the website containing the audio:

Click to View Link

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 7:35:24 PM

"Something that might help .." DB

Fine, I am not a lawyer though perhaps I missed my calling ...

So there are deeper currents afoot, good. I have no problem with that. Not surprisingly we are all opposed to central banking though others have wider concerns. Yet, central banking is the root.

I have not listened to all the audio you suggested but will bookmark it for later listening.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 7:51:19 PM

"This is your idea of justice?" DB

I am a subversive (for good, I hope). Liberty in money creation will correct much that is wrong with our society so I focus on that as a strategic goal. Yet, justice cannot be ignored either. Those who have looted by government privilege may be looted by it justly too to compensate their victims.

Yet, if I had to choose between justice and liberty, I would pick liberty.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Yet in another comment you indicated you would choose justice BEFORE liberty. We like this comment better.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/29/2010 8:41:23 PM

"Yet in another comment you indicated you would choose justice BEFORE liberty. " DB

Of course I would prefer BOTH. But if I had to chose, then I would chose liberty since it will certainly lead to justice. However, I don't see why we should have to choose.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

In previous feedbacks you have indicated you want to use the paraphernalia of the current and existing fiat mechanisms to promote "justice. Using your own logic, then, you CAN'T have both. And using the current system to promote "justice" is to us questionable in the extreme.

Posted by Scott Burrow on 5/29/2010 9:48:08 PM

There's an excellent article on single global currency developments by Carl Teichrib. He wrote it back in 2007 and he documents it with central banking reports. You can read it at Click to View Link

His report was re-published by Icfai University Press. I checked it out and Icfai commissioned a book titled "A Single Global Currency: Perspectives and Challenges." Benn Steil from the CFR also had an essay in the book. Teichrib was critical on the establishment of a global central bank. The Daily Bell should check out his report.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

This is a superb analysis. Thanks. Of course there already is a global money - gold and silver. But it has literally been banned while the powers-that-be try desperately to heave paper money into its place.

Posted by Weeble on 5/29/2010 11:18:25 PM

I read the Carl Teichrib article (very good by the way) and immediately thought of the Chinese word "weiji". Since the Chinese write in pictures, the picture showed crisis = opportunity.

They have not dumped the dollar, but if the sovereign debt crisis does not pan out as planned, they would have an immediate "ace in the hole". I wonder what the Chinese word for that would be?

Posted by Hamurobby on 5/30/2010 1:12:14 AM

Incredibly, there can be no justice with the system the way it is. Some think we have 3.5 years? I doubt it, as the realisation of the fraud and injustice is spreading, the CONfidence in the dollear is failing. If pimco and other funds are questioning buying treasuries now, it wont be long until the world realises the fed is (in)directly monetising the us debt.

The savers were long ago destroyed when the gold was removed from currency and given to the elite by their servants. The only hope left is for the restoration of liberty. Just like the last 5k years, we would revert back to a pm backed currency, with strict fractional lending. Who knows, we might actually have market controlled interest rates and savers would get 7% again and could retire without ss!!!!! What a concept! And maybe this time we wont let our government and the 4th federal bank steal our money. Get yourself some real money with your currency, while you still can.

Question, Who is propping up the euro, the US to keep China able to buy debt, or China themselves? If this was an orchestrated crisis, they would let the euro go to parity and destroy China's ability to sell goods to europe, and then not be able to buy US debt.

I just think they all are losing control. In fact I think the nwo conspiracy theory is even encouraged to give people confidence that if it were to all fly apart, there would be a default currency to somehow save us but with consequences. This in itself inspires confidence in the "system" status quo, and it implies what we have is better than what we would get if it were to fail.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

We agree. The NWO/Illuminati promotion is intended to make the power elite look infallible and omnipotent. It is not. We've written about this. Thanks.

Posted by Hamurobby on 5/30/2010 1:27:46 AM

The easiest way to go back to a gold backed currency would be a simple revaluation of the gold reserves held by the central banks. All that would have to happen is the decimal place be moved over two places in the gold and silver price and voila, instant backing for fiat, and one hell of a redistribution of wealth. Justice may be served to the savers?


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Interesting idea!

Posted by F. Beard on 5/30/2010 6:08:06 AM

"In previous feedbacks you have indicated you want to use the paraphernalia of the current and existing fiat mechanisms to promote "justice. Using your own logic, then, you CAN'T have both." DB

Not only would it be just, it would be poetic justice to loot the banking establishment in a manner similar to how they have looted, not for the sake of revenge but to bailout the debtors and compensate savers. Remember, the banks are already being bailed out and they are the villains not the victims.

But forget my proposal to use fiat, what do you think of Warren Mosler's proposal to eliminate the Payroll tax? That tax is extremely regressive and the abolition of it would allow many to keep their homes.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

The changes to the system need to be deeper than that in our opinion.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/30/2010 6:22:18 AM

"All that would have to happen is the decimal place be moved over two places in the gold and silver price and voila, instant backing for fiat, and one hell of a redistribution of wealth. Justice may be served to the savers?" Hamurobby

Do you mean justice to the precious metals hoarders? Why should their hoards be revalued by government FIAT (command)?

"Reply from the Daily Bell:

Interesting idea!"

Really? You find my ideas inconsistent but think revaluing precious metals by government command is an "Interesting idea!"

Posted by Weeble on 5/30/2010 9:13:03 AM

Is Hamurobby speaking in code? I personally believe Fort Knox to be empty, that sovereign governments are buying gold with fiat, then distributing it to themselves and others as payment for their "humanitarian efforts": or simply "tribute", and that transposing decimals is mere alchemy. Sorry Hammurabi, but that house would not be engineered correctly, and we would suffer the customary consequences.

Posted by Hamurobby on 5/30/2010 9:35:13 AM

F Beard, I am simply trying to find the most painless reform of fiat currency for now. Hoarders you call the gold bugs, well at what point was a currency in the Malthus/Keynes system worthy of "saving"?

It was NEVER intended to be saved, but used as a medium of exchange. Stores of wealth have always been pm's, land and assetts, not fiat paper currency. If you are looking for justice for fiat savers, well they have their "just"ice rewards for not bothering to understand the diffences of money and currency.

I aplaud your efforts to offer solutions and your opinions on the subject, however we dont get to "choose our destructor". We can only hope to decifer the future and position our selves accordingly.

My "solution" isnt about what I would do if I were king, (nor did I come up with the idea) but what will probably be chosen by the powers that be. It is not perfect nor would it be as simple as moving a decimal point, but it would be easy to implement, as it would just be a revaluation of "savings" rather than an overhaul of the immensely complex fiat systems the central banks have created.

Why we as a people dont understand that banks have GOLD in their vaults, but we can't see it as a money, defies logic? 70 years of relentless idealism has left the masses broke and starving in Ceaser's villages. There is no justice for fools, only the hope of liberty. The only justice will be the deflection of total anarchy and destruction in a capitulation of fiat currency. The rules will change to protect the powerfull, and to keep the "system" (mime) operational, we pissants be damned.

Posted by Hamurobbby on 5/30/2010 9:40:31 AM

Is Hamurobby speaking in code? I personally believe Fort Knox to be empty, that sovereign governments are buying gold with fiat, then distributing it to themselves and others as payment for their "humanitarian efforts": or simply "tribute", and that transposing decimals is mere alchemy. Sorry Hammurabi, but that house would not be engineered correctly, and we would suffer the customary consequences.

I agree, I believe the 6% to be paid in gold and the $44. per ounce valuation by the treasury to be related?... Also imho the alchemy you speak of has already happened, there are flaws in the fiat price discovery of pm's now, through deception and suppression.

Posted by Hugo on 5/30/2010 10:06:49 AM

I would like to bring this speech by Vitor Constincio (head of the Portuguese Central Bank) on the 5th of may to your attention.

Click to View Link

It holds some interesting statements. The most important is

"....including the creation of an European Monetary Fund that had been foreseen in very early discussions about monetary union.... (p 4 second paragraph)."

Also noteworthy ....

''Seeking Europe, is to make her!" and "Adventure- or modern high culture has robbed us of any lofty spiritual goals behind our endeavours to build a unified Europe.''

It is not a happy read but I always find it worthy to read what our completely out of touch with reality, megalomanic rulers think and get a better understanding how their picking order works. It is always the same in dictatorships. Rewarding failure, corruption, counterfitting and punishing the people who had nothing to do with that.

I would like to quote Ayn Rand (atlas shrugged);

Money is the barometer of a society's virtue. When you see that trading is done, not by consent, but by compulsion, when you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain perimssion from men who produce nothing, when you see that men get richer by graft and by pull than by work, and your laws don't protect you against them, you will know that your society is doomed."

Posted by Victor Barney on 5/30/2010 10:22:56 AM

Laugh if you would like, but this is all leading up to a "cashless society" described in the Set-Apart Hebrew Scriptures! By the way, these "Hebrew" Set-Apart Scriptures...

(Only the Hebrew Scriptures are heavenly inspired it actually states) are only meant for Israel and any gentile called out of Babylon!

We're coincidently getting really close to the Biblical end of man's age and I find it very interesting that America actually is from the seed of Joseph, which was given the "Name" Israel(Great Britain & America), but lost the identifying sign(sabbath) and now America has appointed a "foreigner"(non-Israelite, no matter "where" he was really born!)over them(Deuteronomy 17:15)!

I even understand that it was the "women" vote who got the job done! Let's see, we first had Adam and Eve, Eve sinned had caused Adam to sin, along comes Cain(who received a "mark" so that everybody could recognize him) and on the verge of 6,000 years later(man's period)nothing has changed has it? Well, except that the Hebrew(not Greek or Latin) "Savior" has come and nobody REALLY even cares!

To quote from these Hebrew Set-Apart Scriptures: "Tell me the Fathers Name and the Son's Name if you can?" Although it has been found by some, it's shocking that they are not called Christians, isn't it? Will you really be ready? If you are looking for scientific proof that these Hebrew Set-Apart Scriptures are true, proven through scientific "deduction" please contact e-mail: Click to Email;

Posted by B. Feard on 5/30/2010 11:19:27 AM

F.Beard - please educate yourself and read about Cantillon effects. Your collectivist solutions of "averaged out payments" betray your absolute lack of respect for any form of justice.

Also, please keep in mind that logorrhea is not a substitute for logical arguments.

Posted by Hamurobby on 5/30/2010 11:20:20 AM

The reading of the Bible and other religious documents should be required, if not for an understanding of faith, but an understanding of the evils of man. I believe this is why Religion is scoffed by so many so called scholars as it educates as well as enlightens.

Usury is in a way, slavery, and in some countries it is still illegal. I am not abdicating banking, but real and reasonable unrevocable laws of banking punishable by death and actually upheld by a true judicial system may be brutal, but its the only way it can work without being exploited.

I thought that was how the Constitution was written, but I guess it has been um, interpreted differently by those who would gain the most from it. Some of the fairest rulers in history were the most ruthless and unmerciful. The Asians dont mind putting to death those who would use the system for themselves, yet we now encourage it in the western world. The system was corrupted and then dismantled and restarted by men of conviction the FIRST time, the second time by men who had no cause but to serve themselves.

Since then we have changed from a nation of property ownership and self reliance to one of debt and servitude, yet we think we are better off, but only because we dont know any better! The only hope we have of currency and money surviving in this system, is a revaluation of pm's relating to central bank liabilities, or total anarchy or another ww and a complete restart. Hopefully there will be enough civilization remaining if that occurs.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/30/2010 1:52:47 PM

"F.Beard - please educate yourself and read about Cantillon effects. Your collectivist solutions of "averaged out payments" betray your absolute lack of respect for any form of justice." B. Feared

A very harsh charge. While some have concentrated on bailing out the debtors I have proposed compensating the savers too though in some cases they are just vultures longing for a deflationary depression so they can buy assets on the cheap. Running fractional reserve lending BACKWARDS, as I have sometimes proposed is not only just, it is elegant too and bails out the underwater home owners, bails out the banks in nominal terms, and compensates savers too.

"Also, please keep in mind that logorrhea is not a substitute for logical arguments. " B. Feared

I'm as logical as anyone here, I'd hazard. My career for many years was computer simulations. I had to use quite a bit of Boolean logic toward that purpose. Perhaps I confuse you with the various alternatives I've offered.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/30/2010 2:03:24 PM

"I am simply trying to find the most painless reform of fiat currency for now. Hoarders you call the gold bugs, well at what point was a currency in the Malthus/Keynes system worthy of "saving"?

It was NEVER intended to be saved, but used as a medium of exchange. Stores of wealth have always been pm's, land and assetts, not fiat paper currency. If you are looking for justice for fiat savers, well they have their "just"ice rewards for not bothering to understand the diffences of money and currency. " Hamurobbby

I see you are a Joni Mitchell ("just"ice) fan :)

Yes you make good points, fiat is not a store of wealth. However, there are some who'd welcome deflation to gain back the purchasing power in fiat they lost during the boom even at the risk of jeopardizing peace. However if the looting mechanism called FRL was run BACKWARDS, it would compensate savers so I don't dispute the justice of their claims, just the method by which they seek to be compensated (deflation).


Reply from the Daily Bell:

"However if the looting mechanism called FRL was run BACKWARDS, it would compensate savers so I don't dispute the justice of their claims, just the method by which they seek to be compensated."

You may wish to explain how all this would work in a little more detail. Some of our readers may not understand what FLR means. Others may not understand the use of the word "backwards." Still others may not understand what any of this has to do with "justice" or how the mechanism you propose would compensate savers, etc. Just a thought. Your arguments might be better understood if they were more clearly expressed.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/30/2010 3:16:16 PM

"You may wish to explain how all this would work in a little more detail. Some of our readers may not understand what FLR means. Others may not understand the use of the word "backwards." Still others may not understand what any of this has to do with "justice" or how the mechanism you propose would compensate savers, etc."

Fractional reserve lending (FRL) is the process by which banks lend out more money than they have on deposit. In effect, the banks create money out of nothing by lending it. In other words they counterfeit money. I suggest Murray N Rothbard's "The Mystery of Banking" available in a nice hardbound 2nd edition from Mises.org for a detailed explanation. It is also available as a free pdf download from Mises.org.

Since the banking system can create and lend out many times more money than they have as deposits, they effectively suppress the interest rates they need to pay savers for those deposits. Who needs savers' money to lend out when the banks can simply create their own (temporary) money and lend it out? Traditionally, the banking system has created 10-12 times the amount of money on deposit. In the last boom, the ratio was much higher, around 30 times the money on deposit. So FRL cheats savers of honest interest rates.

With that same money-from-thin-air as Rothbard called it, housing prices and the stock market were driven higher just as counterfeiting on a large scale would do. However it is much more unjust than that with banks. The banks LEND out their counterfeit money. As the money is repaid it goes out of existence but leaves behind debt that must be repaid at boom prices. Thus borrowers are cheated too. They end up owning homes that are worth less than the debt owned on them because a shrinking money supply normally causes prices to go down just as an expanding money supply normally causes prices to go up.

So, both savers and borrowers are cheated by fractional reserve lending. As for running FRL backwards, it is mostly an intellectual exercise to determine how to justly bailout debtors and compensate savers. Basically, debt-free money would be given to underwater homeowners to pay down their debts to market prices. Rather than let that new money end up as banker's Equity, the banks would be forced to distribute that new money to all bank accounts on a pro-rata basis thus compensating savers.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Great explanation - and a revealing one. Our previous comment stands (long ago.) This is a Brownian analysis and you either have read her material or come to similar solutions on your own. Also ... to implement your plan would call for wholesale sociopolitical changes within the Western world - virtually an entire new monetary infrastructure - and you would still be using the same fiat money system that has brought so much destruction as an antidote for the same system.

We find it more likely that the old structure will in sense simply collapse and that a market-based gold and silver standard might emerge out of the chaos. This is a far simpler chain of events. Alternatively, of course, the elite itself will seek to create a new money out of the disorder. We believe this is the intention, in fact.

Posted by Hugo on 5/30/2010 3:48:34 PM

I wonder if the daily bell knows about the freegold concept? In short private physical gold competes with the fiat governments issue. I think the elites know WW3 will whipe out humanity. It will bring neo feodalism though. fofoa.blogspot.com holds many very interesting views/articles on this concept.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/30/2010 3:51:57 PM

"This is a Brownian analysis and you either have read her material or come to similar solutions on your own." DB

I came to those conclusions on my own. I am just barely and just recently acquainted with MS Browns' work. However, I don't doubt we might both be standing on the shoulders of others such as Rothbard, Thoren, and others.

"Also ... to implement your plan would call for wholesale sociopolitical changes within the Western world - virtually an entire new monetary infrastructure - and you would still be using the same fiat money system that has brought so much destruction as an antidote for the same system." DB

I guess I have not made my self clear. I propose a one-time just reset using fiat to be followed by total liberty in money creation. Legal tender fiat would be abolished soon after the reset. The value of government money would backed by its taxing authority not legal tender laws.

"We find it more likely that the old structure will in sense simply collapse and that a market-based gold and silver standard might emerge out of the chaos. This is a far simpler chain of events." DB

If enough people understood how FRL has cheated them and if savers and debtors realized that they have a common enemy, the banking system, then a just reset would be possible without risking the turmoil of a great Depression.

"Alternatively, of course, the elite itself will seek to create a new money out of the disorder. We believe this is the intention, in fact." DB

Yes, that's something I wish to head off. Also, Ellen Brown's solution, though it might easily work well for a while involves further PERMANENT centralization. The reset I propose, is a one-time printing of legal tender fiat to bailout the debtors and compensate the savers.

No doubt many solutions will be offered in the times ahead. It is helpful to me to understand who is at fault and who isn't.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

"Also, Ellen Brown's solution, though it might easily work well for a while involves further PERMANENT centralization. The reset I propose, is a one-time printing of legal tender fiat to bailout the debtors and compensate the savers."

Yes, this is the problem we have with her solution as well. Anyway, now it is clearer. You propose a one-time reset followed by free-banking (free-market liberty in monetary creation).

Interesting point of view. Thanks for the clarifications.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/30/2010 4:04:29 PM

"You propose a one-time reset followed by free-banking (free-market liberty in monetary creation). " DB

Exactly. But also, I don't want what I think is the ultimate money form, common stock, to be overlooked when it is time for monetary reform.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Well, in a free-market, people would have a choice. History tells us they will choose gold and silver over common stock. But, as we have written before, it would be nice to have a choice.

Posted by F. Beard on 5/30/2010 7:18:32 PM

""The economic adjustment process will be more difficult and prolonged than for other economies with AAA rated sovereign governments, which is why the agency has downgraded Spain's rating to AA ," it said.

"The inflexibility of the labour market and the restructuring of regional and local savings banks will... hinder the pace of adjustment, particularly in the aftermath of the real estate boom," it warned.

The European Union has been anxious to see more fragile European economies - including Spain, Portugal and Greece - impose tougher austerity measures. " from

Click to View Link

Ah yes, the problem of "sticky" wages. Why should anyone take a pay cut due to a shrinkage of the money supply and/or a decline in velocity of the money when the debt on their homes does not shrink to market prices? Ah, the blessings of an "elastic" money supply! No, it is a curse instead.

Posted by AmanfromMars on 5/31/2010 1:08:28 AM

"You may wish to explain how all this would work in a little more detail. Some of our readers may not understand what FLR [sic] means. Others may not understand the use of the word "backwards." "

The series of five short YouTube videos ..... "Where does money come from" .... with Part 1 being found here, Click to View Link .... explains the global banking and ignorant man's pitiful, pitiless enslavement to magically conjured up artificial indebtedness scam very clearly.

Revolutions and wars have been many times started for less, and been heralded, just and right ..... "It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." .... Henry Ford ...... and in past times, many a severed head on a pike less deserved of its fate in revenge and popular natural justice doled out by the mob, which is what I imagine is the crooked dealers' greatest fear with the sharing of core knowledge and greater wisdom ...... No Place to Hide from the Raw Law and Merciless Punishment of the Naked Jungle.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

Thanks for the update and resources.

Posted by Steve Harrison on 5/31/2010 2:52:16 AM

After this period of rebalancing the purchasing power of the non-elite world i speculate they plan an SDR structured currency backed by IMF issued Carbon Credits (finite like gold but the 'science' is totally in their control). This is nothing short of an energy credit that will hand total power to the elite.

Click to View Link

Problem is AGW thanks to the internet has been debunked. No doubt they will repackage this and come at us again from a different angle.

Posted by Dave J. on 5/31/2010 2:56:54 AM

Lindsey Williams' 3 DVDs from January 2010, , report that the 87 yr. old top elite who has been informing him accurately of their plans in advance for 35 years told him they will cause moderate inflation in the U.S. dollar in 2010, but will bring down the dollar, the U.S. and the countries of Europe in 2011-2012 by hyperinflation.

The elite told Mr. Williams they will do this to cause chaos and then bring order out of chaos by starting their New World Order and their one world currency. Apparently they have decided to leap frog over the North American Union and the Amero and go straight to the One World currency which I imagine they will call the Uno.

The elite also implied that they will start a huge war involving Iran during 2011-2012. I suppose they will use this ghastly, war which will probably include nuclear bomb exchanges to further help frighten the people of the world into accepting the NWO and the Uno. Can a chip in every person on Earth be far behind?

Posted by Steve Harrison on 5/31/2010 3:06:55 AM

They can easily cause the hyperinflation by reversing the current supression of the futures markets

Click to View Link

Click to View Link

The gun is loaded.

Posted by Peter Rudolph Zidek on 5/31/2010 2:16:19 PM

Justice? Liberty?

I constantly remind myself. Why do people accept the fact that it is obvious that politicians, government, and the power elites have created the mess, then turn a 180 and ask politicians and government to fix the mess. Is this an oxymoron?? Or am I missing something here??

"Government is a disease masquerading as its own cure"....
Kenneth Royce

"you can't solve a problem with the same thinking that created the problem". Einstein

Posted by Dan on 5/31/2010 3:57:09 PM

Dear Bell, your article is great, of course. I have no dispute with your perceptions. I do take issue with the beliefs of the PTB.
They expect to cause a great calamity and out of this calamity will come,,, cohesion?? They're dreaming. Crashing the world will bring cooperation??

Now ,we both know that they probably have contingency plans in case there is resistance. But, on the face of it, calamity brings a shrinking of ones loyalties and "sphere of cooperation"

I believe that the PTB are operating with an old "playbook" We all agree that the internet has brought a whole new level of awareness to the world. It doesn't end there.

If you look at the work of Professor Josephson of Cambridge, he received a Nobel Prize for his work on quantum tunneling. The follow-up work of Rupert Sheldrake proves that all members of a species are in communication by the means of quantum tunneling. His work is well spelled out in " The Hundredth Monkey" This finally brought an explanation of the phenomenon of a whole flock of birds wheeling at the same time.

So, the PTB not only have to contend with an awareness brought on by the internet, they also have to contend with a species consciousness brought about by quantum tunneling.

One sees an "automatic resistance" to many measures that the bankers are trying to force. Everyone is very aware of the lessons from Argentina and Iceland. The French will make a big splash on the world stage too.

I believe that the PTB do not appreciate just how much resistance they will engender. If / when they try to introduce a new "money", people will automatically recoil in hatred,,,, without even knowing the source of their antipathy.

Rather than inspire cooperation, the crash will cause people to look inwards. The history of the nation-state is only about 300 years old. There is still much doubt if it is viable in the long run.

The same goes for the history of the British Banking system. The "corporation" is even younger, I believe.

This calamity is capable of unwinding all of these "constructs".
A "forcing" of acceptance of a fraud currency will cause huge reductions in the farming and resource-extraction industries. These people know what their stuff is worth. They can NEVER be forced to work for a loss. They're already working for razor-thin margins.

I don't need to lay out what a major reduction in farming / resource-extraction would do to the rest of the economy.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

The nation state is ancient, thousands of years old. Western banking in something resembling its current form 1,000 years old or maybe older.

Posted by Dan on 5/31/2010 5:52:02 PM

Wiki disagrees with you;
Click to View Link />Of course, banks have been around for a long time. The BRITISH banking system dates to the 17th century;
Click to View Link />These 2 items weren't the point of my post.

Posted by Boatman on 6/1/2010 6:57:09 AM

@ f beard:

i too read pragcap, and cullen is very right about everything. he has came out and said gold is a good investment, however....it has done very well in this deflationary invironment, as long as it hasn't free-fell like mar 09'-october 09'..............that is changed now too, probably.

any fool can see the euro crisis is DUE to a common currency.
the world will never have one.

Posted by Brian Schuette on 6/1/2010 2:48:23 PM

"However it is also true that this article itself is evidence of the difficulties that the elite would face in implementing the kind of program we have suggested. After all, if we are able to anticipate it, it has occurred to others as well. This is perhaps the elite's biggest challenge in the era of the Internet."

You may be right about that, but the current US political regime already has set it's sights on the particular problem of the internet. The internet is targeted because if you do want the truth it's out there. So if the government can back door massive restrictions on the internet by mis-representing what they really want to do, they will be able to prevent the truth from being told.

The current regime also has it out for any media that has an opposing views other than what they want put out on the mainstream medias. Wasn't it said by someone, "That if you control what the media puts out, that you control what the masses believe". This is currently happening in the US, and you did mention the "power elite." Paranoia, not necessarily, just looking at a few more puzzle pieces.


Reply from the Daily Bell:

It may be happening, but not fast enough. You can turn off the Internet perhaps (we tend to doubt it), but it's a good deal harder to turn off the information that the Internet has already effectively circulated in the past 20 years.

Posted by Lila Rajiva on 6/2/2010 5:36:39 PM

Creditors - in the case of banks lending money - may be government backed cartels. But the investors are simply people who bought bonds or securities as investments. They are not guilty of anything, not even of flipping, since most of them had brokers who sold it to them as sound investments.

Look, as a stock investor, I've lost money to the cartels too. But you cannot save one group by taking money from bystanders. If you can't get the money back from the crooks, then you have to live with the loss. You can't get it back from bystanders.

If the housing market hadn't collapsed, and the homeowners got all the capital gains from their inflated assets, would they have given that profit to people who couldn't afford houses because of the bubble? I bet not.

Would they offer to share their profts with people who were locked into assets that didn't rise?

I bet not.

Either you have the will and cojones to prosecute the real crooks and penalize the industry to pay for the losses or you eat them yourself, unfortunately. You don't suddenly invoke brotherly love so you can debase the currency and stiff the savers who've been footing all the bills since 1970.

Posted by Lila Rajiva on 6/2/2010 6:32:58 PM

Also, @ Beard.

There is not equation between debtor and savers. Savers are doing what is good for the economy, working and foregoing consumption. That is producing.

They cannot help that the FDIC guarantees bank deposits. That was put in place to protect them from runs on the bank caused by endless roll over of debt via fractional banking loans.

Debtors, on the contrary, are not producers but takers...and consumers.

Savers deserve interest because they FOREGO CONSUMPTION.

There is not equation between the two.

Savers are people who put food on the table for everyone. Consumers eat. And borrowers are eating their share and other people's too.

So your arguments are obfuscation.

Re- housing. The overall amount of capital saved in an economy is irrelevant to the question of whether EACH INDIVIDUAL has a "right" to a house.

One, there is no such right.
Two, unless he has the money to pay for it, any money he borrows and doesn't pay back makes the house belong to someone else, not him, since he hasn't paid for it.

If he was tricked or cheated, he should join forces with other victims and get the money back from the cheaters - the fraudulent mortgage originators and banks. He shouldn't be trying to pass his losses to people who not only didn't have anything to do with it, they are the true victims of the story, since it's their money everyone else is gambling with.

Posted by Seumas on 6/11/2010 5:51:14 AM

Isn't this sovereign debt "crisis" simply a cunning method devised by the financiers to bundle all the losses they made on ridiculous and fraudulent derivatives onto the taxpayer and common man?

All this talk of unsustainable government debt is nonsense. Government debt is not like any other debt that it needs to be repaid. You simply roll it over by issuing new bonds, or manipulate your long term fiscal policy to manage it. There is no difference toady then at any time in history. The media is simply pushing this as it wants everyone to accept pay cuts and public service cuts.

Between 1920 and 1939, the UK had a debt to (GDP) ratio of around 175%. It rose even higher after the war, but then from around 1950 to the mid 1970s, it did what? It declined dramatically. And what else happened during that period? Government spending on national social welfare projects such as education and health rose massively. This is also the time of greatest advancement in standards of living than any other time in history, a time when government spent heavily upon society. Strange, no?

Austerity? What can that achieve? It will send economies back into heavy and lasting recession, and will only make the situation worse with increased welfare payments and decreased tax income. Unless of course, the governments of the developed world have agreed that it will be okay once again to see people living in cardboard boxes and starving.

Because that is the only possible outcome from the agenda that is now being pushed down our throats by the media. Decreased welfare payments Fewer public jobs A banking sector discredited and reeling from a recent crisis = Mass Poverty. Truly, this could see God forbid, many developed nations become true third world nations again with mass poverty and non existent public services. Just like Africa, Asia, South America.

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