News & Analysis
The Problem Is Money Power
Racist Marxist Israel ... "The Life of an American Jew in Racist Marxist Israel," Written in 1985 by Jack Bernstein. A CHALLENGE: THE CONTENTS OF THIS BOOK ARE EXPECTED TO BRING A STRONG REACTION FROM THE ZIONIST JEWS. I am well aware of the tactics of you, my Zionist brethren, use to quiet anyone who attempts to expose any of your subversive acts. If the person is a Gentile, you cry, "You're anti-Semitic" which is nothing more than a smokescreen to hide your actions. But, if a Jew is the person doing the exposing, you resort to other tactics. First, you ignore the charges, hoping the information will not be given widespread distribution. If the information starts reaching too many people, you ridicule the information and the persons giving the information. If that doesn't work, your next step is character assassination. If the author or speaker hasn't been involved in sufficient scandal you are adept at fabricating scandal against the person or persons. If none of these are effective, you are known to resort to physical attacks. But, NEVER do you try to prove the information wrong. – Rense
Dominant Social Theme: Zionism is what's wrong with the world. Get rid of the Zionists and the world will be OK again.
Free-Market Analysis: Yesterday we ran an article by a passionate, committed and talented poetess named Dr. Lasha Darkmoon who wrote an article recently about the takeover of America (and the West generally) by World Jewry. You can see the article here: Israel in Charge?
The article ran in the popular alternative media news source, Rense.com, which had the distinction of being singled out by the Bush administration as a problematic website that dealt in disinformation. Cleverly, Rense has used Bush's denunciation as an endorsement.
Now we are a tiny thing, merely a pimple on the back of the alternative press's elephant. We don't assume for a minute that Rense and other such media presences know about us, or care about us or our modest (perhaps laughable) attempts at analysis of the modern scene even if by some chance they were aware of us.
And yet for some reason today there were posted on the Rense website numerous articles about Zionism including this one above, which caught our eye. Others might believe that Rense was engaging in a kind of backdoor conversation on this issue, but we are wiser and more realistic than that. We realize it was only coincidence.
However, these postings do give us a reason to revisit the subject. And we should because it is a most important one. The alternative press's growing insistence (portions of it) on demonizing ALL Jews (or even all Zionists) is bound to have an impact on OTHER issues that those in the alternative media discuss. It may even have an impact on the good that the Internet can do.
Many people in America and Europe may be accepting of certain larger truths about Money Power but discouraged by heated attacks on Jews and Zionists generically. Here's some more from this article (excerpted above):
Yesterday, for instance, we pointed out we disagreed with Dr. Darkmoon's assessment of World Jewry, as elegant and committed as it was, and explained that we believed people who damned "all Jews" or "all Zionists" were aiming at the wrong target.
We explained (as we have before) that the main problem of the modern world is the corrosive ability of the Anglosphere power elite (which includes at its heart Jewish central banking families along with various enforcers, enablers and associates) to print endless amounts of money from nothing.
Without this tool, Jews, Zionists, one-worlders (what have you) would be increasingly helpless to implement their plans in the modern era in our humble opinion. Those manipulating the power of central banks are not all Jewish by any means, by the way.
They are in fact something a motley crew (though we know some might suggest that those who are not Jewish are "crypto Jews" – but surely this is a conversation for another day) and thus we have suggested that one ought to look at the problems of the world as being caused, primarily, by this "cartel" or mafia.
The top people in this cartel might be seen as and many Jewish people are "hired in" to this cartel just as many Italians are hired into the Mafia. But when one speaks of the Mafia, one is not apt to include ALL Italians in the description.
Likewise, cartels can have many hanger-oners, but this doesn't mean all the hanger-oners are privy to what goes on inside. Thus, Jews who endorse the one-world goals of the modern cartel/mafia may not actually be directly linked to its operations.
The article posted at the Rense site does a public service (as do many of Rense's posts) if only because it provides us with what is apparently a genuine Jewish voice decrying Zionists and "Zionist brethren." The main points of the lengthy article are made at the end. There are two of them, as follows:
The Stakes — Freedom or Slavery ... In deciding the course of action to be taken to stop the Zionist/Bolshevik 'War Lords' two points are the keys and must be restated and emphasized:
1. One leg of the Zionist/Bolshevik Jews is based in New York City. It was from this base that financial and organizational aid was given to carry out the Bolshevik Revolution in Russia. This revolution enabled the establishment of the second leg of the Zionist/Communist power, Moscow. If it were not for the continued support by the New York Zionist/Bolshevik Jews and their nation-wide network, communism would have collapsed long ago. But, the various facets of power held by these Zionists in America, have enabled them to trick the American people into supporting communism.
2. Communism would not have gotten started and most problems faced by Americans would not have developed if the newsmedia would have kept the American people informed about the actions of the Zionist/Bolsheviks. However these Zionist/Bolshevik (communist) Jews are clever. Before they began their acts of a subversion in America, they gained control of the major newspapers and especially the news services which supply national and international news to the smaller daily newspapers. Since they controlled, and still control, the major news-media outlets, including radio and television, they have been able to distort or omit the truth about their subversive acts.
We do find the above statements somewhat problematic. The gentleman involved, as passionate and sincere as any other, makes certain statements throughout the lengthy article that we might take issue with from a factual standpoint.
But our bottom line disagreement is with the "naming" of the elements involved. He labels them Zionist/Bolshevik 'War Lords' while we call them the Anglosphere power elite. Beyond this, our labeling is more inclusive. We think the conspiracy is not simply a Jewish one. And we think it is driven by Money Power. No Money Power, no modern one-world conspiracy, or not as it is currently constituted anway.
We track modern command-and-control conspiracies back to Rome and beyond, back to Babylon, even, as do others, at least from a cultural or historical standpoint. The current conspiracy may be about 300 years old. The most modern elements were added in about a century ago and have been elaborated upon ever since, as central banking has grown more powerful.
Today, central banking runs the world and those who control its spigots are the world's divinity. Are they all Jewish? Is that the real issue? Or is the system itself a more important concern. By focusing on "World Jewry" are some taking their eye off the proverbial ball?
Now some will also point out (as this gentleman does) that such a movement is not so much Jewish as Zionist. And others will point out that Zionism is a utopian movement, not at all restricted to Jews. Our response would be that most people consider Zionism to be a Jewish movement having to do with the creation of a Jewish state. That's the definition we use, too.
From our humble point of view, then, the problem is not "Jewry" or even Zionism. It is Money Power and those who wield it (not all of whom are necessarily Jewish). Reduce or eliminate Money Power and the modern problem is basically dealt with.
Money Power (the mafia or cartel) created the Jewish state. Money Power uses dominant social themes – fear based promotions – to move the world's middle classes toward global governance. Money Power created Tavistock to generate and implement these promotions.
So what make people sure that Zionism and Illuminism are not promotions, too? Everything else is turned into a promotion in the hands of Money Power. Why not the "Jewish question" as well. Why not Zionism? Why not Illuminism?
The object in our view is to create maximum chaos and to set people against one another. The best way to do that is to create ideologies that "divide and conquer." Money Power created communism, socialism and capitalism. Yet for some reason, the modern alternative 'Net intelligentsia only believes that ZIONISM is a sincere manifestation of the perfidity of this cartel.
We offer the modest proposal that those who created modern Zionism – the people at the very top – are not any more sincere about it than they are about their other creations. We offer the modest proposition these people are not "Utopianists" but are clever symbol manipulators and that those who DENOUNCE World Jewry and Zionism are doing, perhaps, exactly what Money Power wishes them to do.
We offer, therefore, the proposition that modern Israel itself was created not only as a "sacred place" but perhaps, as well, as a distraction and an endless irritant. Thus we offer the proposition that those who denounce Israel, who denounce Zionism, who denounce World Jewry are ironically doing the work of the Cartel, at least in part.
Conclusion: When one sees a thief, one does not shout "Stop, Zionist!" of "Stop, Jew!" One shouts "Stop, Thief!" The modern problem in our view – the most important one – is Money Power. Focus on Israel, if you wish (which should become a secular state in our view and should stop persecuting people). Focus on Zionists and Jews as horrible people if you wish (though we don't agree with such demonization). But for goodness' sake, focus first on the REAL issue, which is the enormous power that Money Power PROVIDES.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 02:51 PM
@ Abu Aardvark: in case you are interested in pursuing this discussion further,you can email me at memehunter dot dailybell at gmail dot com (no spaces). I may have further material for you (links and books).
At this point, I'm not sure I wish to pursue this particular discussion on the Daily Bell forum (and DB will probably be happy about it as well), though I reserve a right to reply to direct insults.
My positions have been stated in detail on this thread and on other threads. I thought DB and I had reached some kind of agreement to end this discussion with an "agreement to disagree" (see my post at 11/04/11 05:42 AM), but apparently DB thought otherwise.
In any case, I wish to thank DB for having provided the space for this discussion and I will reiterate that, while DB does a great job in general, I disagree strongly with the general gist of DB's position as expressed in the three articles on Zionism published this week.
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Posted by Abu Aardvark on 11/04/11 01:43 PM
memehunter: "I also note that the Protocols still exist, whoever wrote them"
AA: So? Other (much older) books and documents - fake or real - do still exist.
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memehunter: "I get the impression that you are eager to disprove this author rather than to actually look at the information he presented. You do not give the impression of having truly read him, just trying to find a way to quickly disprove him"
AA: I have NOT read THE book. I have, however, read articles and/or book-chapters authored by Jack Bernstein. And I stand by what I said. If an author builds substantial parts of a thesis on a document that never existed - as portrayed by the author - than this fact alone leaves me with no other choice than to reject it.
Click to view link
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memehunter: "Why? Is it because what he presents is making you uncomfortable?"
AA: Look, I debate with some staunch Jewish Zionists in my neighborhood once in a while. I call them "stupid", "ignorant", "racist", "uninformed", "arrogant", "hypocritical", and so on, because they are.
I do NOT call THEM "co-conspirators", "genocidal, talmudic, globalist one-worlders", however, because THEY ARE NOT.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 12:38 PM
No, that's one section of a book that has more than 20 such sections (not exactly "substantial parts", eh?).
I also note that the Protocols still exist, whoever wrote them, and, as some have wryly noted, it turns out that a substantial part of the Protocols has been enacted by the elites during the 20th century, again regardless of who wrote them. These are inconvenient points that do not mesh well with your claim.
As an aside, you are talking about a different book by Bernstein, "My Farewell to Israel", not the one quoted by DB in this article.
I get the impression that you are eager to disprove this author rather than to actually look at the information he presented. You do not give the impression of having truly read him, just trying to find a way to quickly disprove him. Why? Is it because what he presents is making you uncomfortable?
Reply from The Daily Bell
Gee, Memehunter, what are you arguing NOW. We lost track long ago. You simply spew something and act as if it's "debunkery." It's not.
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Posted by Abu Aardvark on 11/04/11 12:24 PM
memehunter: "Aha, and you think you've conveniently disposed of Bernstein in one sentence?"
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If an author builds substantial parts of a thesis on a document that never existed - as portrayed by the author - well, yes, than I do just that. That may seem "convenient" to you, memehunter - to me, the fact that the protocols are fake leave no other choice.
Reply from The Daily Bell
Yes, and some believe they were released by the elites to tar ALL Jews with that particular calumny.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 12:17 PM
From the horse's mouth:
Jack Bernstein: The life of an American Jew in Racist Marxist Israel
THE CONTENTS OF THIS BOOK ARE EXPECTED TO BRING A STRONG REACTION FROM THE ZIONIST JEWS.
I am well aware of the tactics of you, my Zionist brethren, use to quiet anyone who attempts to expose any of your subversive acts. If the person is a Gentile, you cry, "You're anti-semitic" which is nothing more than a smokescreen to hide your actions.
But, if a Jew is the person doing the exposing, you resort to other tactics.
First, you ignore the charges, hoping the information will not be given widespread distribution.
If the information starts reaching too many people, you ridicule the information and the persons giving the information.
If that doesn't work, your next step is character assassination. If the author or speaker hasn't been involved in sufficient scandal you are adept at fabricating scandal against the person or persons.
If none of these are effective, you are known to resort to physical attacks.
But, NEVER do you try to prove the information wrong.
So, before you start your efforts to quiet me, I OFFER THIS CHALLENGE:
You Zionists assemble a number of Zionist Jews and witnesses to support your position; and I will assemble a like number of anti-Zionist, pro-American Jews and witnesses.
Then, the Zionists and the Anti-Zionists will state their position and debate the material in this book as well as related material - the debate TO BE HELD ON PUBLIC TELEVISION.
Let's explore the information and let the American people decide for themselves if the information is true or false.
ISN'T THAT A FAIR CHALLENGE?
Certainly, you will willingly accept the challenge if what I have written is false.
But, if you resort to crying, "Lies, all lies," and refuse to debate the material you will, in effect, be telling the American people that what I have written are the true facts.
Jack Bernstein
DB, perhaps you can write another more detailed article on Bernstein and tell us why do you think he was killed? You have an army of elves at your disposal, after all, so you can answer some of your own questions, no?
Reply from The Daily Bell
In close to 100 posts now we have patiently replied to (too) many of your attempts to explain yourself and your putative racism. You have insisted the average person doesn't think of Jews when he hears "Zionism." You have presented the idea (Lord help us) that an ideology can be "dangerous." You have offered up the thought that the use of "Zionist Jews" is merely descriptive and not racist. On and on, through a dozen more examples we could probably cite.
For some reason you believe it is very important to your argument that Bernstein was apparently silenced. (Presumably by "Zionists.") We have no idea WHY you think it is pertinent. As we just pointed out, his statement that people conflate Zionism with Jews backs OUR point. We believe the mechanism of oppression ought to be presented. You believe the naming of an ideology (and its redefinition) is the most important thing.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 12:00 PM
Abu: If, on the other hand, there IS something special about the Babylonian Talmud - HOW is this connected to events of TODAY's world and/or contemporary Zionism/Zionists/Jews for that matter?
Cf. Douglas Reed. Already covered. Several times.
"Ah, and Jack Bernstein. He refers to the "Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion" as an authentic document ... "
Aha, and you think you've conveniently disposed of Bernstein in one sentence? Question: why was Bernstein killed after publishing his books (you know this, don't you)? Could it be that some revelations were really damaging? See, we can play this game for a long time...
Reply from The Daily Bell
Aha, and you think you've conveniently disposed of Bernstein in one sentence? Question: why was Bernstein killed after publishing his books (you know this, don't you)? Could it be that some revelations were really damaging? See, we can play this game for a long time...
This is typical of your "reasoning." Sorry the gentlemen is dead, but how does it follow that his revelations were so damaging that he was killed? And if so, which ones exactly? Was it because he mentioned the Protocols? Has he explained it to you from beyond the grave?
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 11:50 AM
DB: More animadversions. You want to sue us to shut us up; now you cast your lot with US financial regulators. Is there any part of the current system that you don't wish to endorse in your defense of the term "Zionist Jews?"
DB: Wow, you sure that's true? Anyway, it tells us that you believe no one can make a statement before rigorously checking his or her background before commenting on a specific issue. Here's one for you, a cliche: People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
Hey, you wanted me to justify why I was still using a pseudonym and you wrote "that certainly says something doesn't it?". Believe me, I would like not to have to use a pseudonym. But it was an egregious accusation (to mock me for having to use a pseudonym) and you know it.
Besides, as I have noted, I am discussing with a group of anonymous elves writing under a collective "we", so there is a lack of transparency on both sides, unfortunately.
So, if you didn't like my reply, well, I tell it like it is and it seems to me that the elves really wanted to get down to the nitty-gritty with the tone of this question.
Zionism: here is Jack Bernstein's definition. Note that it is not mine, but I would simply like to point out to the DB that there are other valid definitions of the term.
Click to view link
"To fully understand the story I am about to tell, it is important that you understand what Zionism really is. Zionist propaganda has led the American people to believe that Zionism and Judaism are one and the same and that they are religious in nature. This is a blatant lie.
Judaism is a religion; but Zionism is a political movement started mainly by East European (Ashkenazi) Jews who for centuries have been the main force behind communism/socialism. The ultimate goal of the Zionists is one ONE-WORLD GOVERMENT UNDER THE CONTROL OF THE ZIONISTS AND THE ZIONIST-ORIENTED JEWISH INTERNATIONAL BANKERS."
So there are different definitions and views, and I would argue it is pointless to keep arguing on the exact definition of the word.
Reply from The Daily Bell
We quoted the definitive JEWISH DEFINITION of Zionism. You quote "Jack Bernstein." And Bernstein HIMSELF writes that people believe that "Zionism and Judaism are one and the same." WHICH IS JUST OUR POINT. By using the term Zionist, you are tarring "all Jews" in the popular mind with whatever evil argument you wish to make. You are quoting an individual (in your defense) whose argument supports us! Poor fellow. Maybe launching another 25-30 posts in a single day has tuckered you out. Oops, forgot. You've made the Daily Bell your new vocation ...
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Posted by Abu Aardvark on 11/04/11 11:49 AM
memehunter: "Balfour declaration: I know about this letter, but to me it only shows that the Rothschilds manipulated England into this"
AA: Into WHAT?
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memehunter: "So, the question is, are the Rothschilds to be defined as Zionists or "Anglosphere power elites"? Perhaps both."
Nathan Rothschild: "I care not what puppet is placed upon the throne of England to rule the Empire on which the sun never sets. The man who controls Britain's money supply controls the British Empire, and I control the British money supply"
Click to view link
AA: The last 300 years clearly show that the Rothschilds couldn't care less for "the Jews", apart from having (some of) them at their disposal as a very effective tool - particularly since the creation of Israel.
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memehunter: "Maybe so - I don't know. But then I will point out that the majority of bankers is not to be blamed for the damage done by central banking, the majority of government officials is not to be blamed for the damage done by governments around the world, the majority of British and American citizens is not to be blamed for the damage done by the "Anglosphere power elite" and ... you get the picture."
AA: Correct! While I do believe that WE ALL share a certain amount of responsibility for the mess we're in - simply because we are, obviously, too gullible. However, being USED, unsuspectingly, doesn't make one a co-conspirator. An idiot, maybe, but not an evildoer.
So, yes, I do believe that, "the majority of bankers is not to be blamed for the damage done by central banking, the majority of government officials is not to be blamed for the damage done by governments around the world, the majority of British and American citizens is not to be blamed for the damage done by the "Anglosphere power elite"
BTW: What would you "do" with the majority of bankers, government officials and British and American citizens, if you'd have a say in this matter?
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memehunter: "I listed facts on this thread - you may have missed them"
AA: No, I missed nothing. "Facts" to prove WHAT POINT, exactly?
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memehunter: Has the DB named names (besides the Rothschilds and the "Anglosphere power elite")? I will point out that most of the DB's model is also based on "hints and insinuations" (they themselves admitted it earlier on the thread) - it is not my fault if this is a topic that is difficult to research. Whom exactly does the DB, accuse of what, exactly? I'd like to know ... "
AA: It's all there in those DB-pages, memehunter. Just ONE example here:
Click to view link
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memehunter: "Why should I, and only I, be held to a different standard?
AA: I don't see anyone doing that to you. However, you seem to insist on something that you are not able to specify.
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memehunter: "Besides, it's not like I have an army of elves to do my research - please keep this in mind."
AA: Well, who does, actually?
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memehunter: "I don't think there is anything special about the individuals (again, do not confuse my position with the DB's claims), but I believe that there is something special about the Babylonian Talmud. Have you actually looked at it, Abu? Did you read Jack Bernstein, by the way?"
AA: So, there's nothing special about "the individuals"? Well, WHO are they anyhow (those who have nothing special about them), then?
If, on the other hand, there IS something special about the Babylonian Talmud - HOW is this connected to events of TODAY's world and/or contemporary Zionism/Zionists/Jews for that matter?
Ah, and Jack Bernstein. He refers to the "Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion" as an authentic document ...
Click to view link
... which it is NOT.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 11:17 AM
DB: It is enlightening and sad, however, that you resort to threatening us under your pseudonym. That certainly says something doesn't it?
M: OK, let's get down to the nitty-gritty. That's what the elves want...
Unlike some important DB elves (the info is available on the 'Net), I did not engage in questionable financial speculations which ensured my financial safety for life, thereby enabling me to write on whichever topic I want without any worry. So, yes, I use a pseudonym. Any questions? Should I feel ashamed?
Some elves are still closely associated with major Anglo-American banks, despite regularly denouncing mercantilism, "money power", and the "Anglosphere power elite" on these pages. How's that for a contradiction? What does that tell us?
DB: Your endless imputations that you are enlightening us are wearying.
M: Yet, the DB thanked me for mentioning Schlomo Sand's book and apparently had not read Reed's book before I mentioned it on these pages.
DB: generally implying we are a third column for the CIA.
M: Where did I say this? Exact quote, please.
DB: Zionism is stand-in word for "Jews."
M: Just because DB says so does not make it true. Unfortunately for DB, it does not yet have the power to impose its word definitions on everyone else...
Reply from The Daily Bell
DB: It is enlightening and sad, however, that you resort to threatening us under your pseudonym. That certainly says something doesn't it?
M: OK, let's get down to the nitty-gritty. That's what the elves want...
Unlike some important DB elves (the info is available on the 'Net), I did not engage in questionable financial speculations which ensured my financial safety for life, thereby enabling me to write on whichever topic I want without any worry. So, yes, I use a pseudonym. Any questions? Should I feel ashamed?
DB: More animadversions. You want to sue us to shut us up; now you cast your lot with US financial regulators. Is there any part of the current system that you don't wish to endorse in your defense of the term "Zionist Jews?"
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Some elves are still closely associated with major Anglo-American banks, despite regularly denouncing mercantilism, "money power", and the "Anglosphere power elite" on these pages. How's that for a contradiction? What does that tell us?
DB: Wow, you sure that's true? Anyway, it tells us that you believe no one can make a statement before rigorously checking his or her background before commenting on a specific issue. Here's one for you, a cliche: People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
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Yet, the DB thanked me for mentioning Schlomo Sand's book and apparently had not read Reed's book before I mentioned it on these pages.
DB: Perhaps that was before you endlessly clogged these threads with your egregious justifications of what to us is nothing but a kind of racism.
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Generally implying we are a third column for the CIA. M: Where did I say this? Exact quote, please.
DB: Hard to quote an "implication." Rattling on about crypto Birchers is a start, with all that implies - to you, anyway.
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Zionism is stand-in word for "Jews." ... M: Just because DB says so does not make it true. Unfortunately for DB, it does not yet have the power to impose its word definitions on everyone else...
DB: You are truly "losing it." Here is a definition of Zionism from the Click to view link. Notice it has "something" to do with Jews.
A Definition of Zionism ...
Zionism, the national movement for the return of the Jewish people to their homeland and the resumption of Jewish sovereignty in the Land of Israel, advocated, from its inception, tangible as well as spiritual aims. Jews of all persuasions, left and right, religious and secular, joined to form the Zionist movement and worked together toward these goals. Disagreements led to rifts, but ultimately, the common goal of a Jewish state in its ancient homeland was attained. The term “Zionism” was coined in 1890 by Nathan Birnbaum.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 10:28 AM
Balfour declaration: I know about this letter, but to me it only shows that the Rothschilds manipulated England into this.
So, the question is, are the Rothschilds to be defined as Zionists or "Anglosphere power elites"? Perhaps both.
Besides, you know as well as I do that Zionism is much older than that, and that its roots are located in the Talmud (again, see Reed and others for details). So, you may have a point for "contemporary Zionism", although as I showed it is not crystal-clear, but Zionism is historically much older than that.
"Hence my assessment that the overwhelming majority of contemporary Zionists is NOT to be blamed for the damage done in the name of Zionism."
Maybe so - I don't know. But then I will point out that the majority of bankers is not to be blamed for the damage done by central banking, the majority of government officials is not to be blamed for the damage done by governments around the world, the majority of British and American citizens is not to be blamed for the damage done by the "Anglosphere power elite" and ... you get the picture.
Agreed?
".. I think it would be helpful if you would start to name names and list facts. Put another way: WHOM, exactly, do you accuse of WHAT, exactly? So far you haven't done that - while posting scores of hints and insinuations."
No, I disagree. I listed facts on this thread - you may have missed them. Has the DB named names (besides the Rothschilds and the "Anglosphere power elite")? I will point out that most of the DB's model is also based on "hints and insinuations" (they themselves admitted it earlier on the thread) - it is not my fault if this is a topic that is difficult to research. Whom exactly does the DB, accuse of what, exactly? I'd like to know. Why should I, and only I, be held to a different standard? Besides, it's not like I have an army of elves to do my research - please keep this in mind.
'Or is it that you embrace the notion that there's INDEED something "special" about Jews and/or Zionists, besides serving as just another (rather important, admittedly) elite-tool, that others, not so "courageous" contemporaries, fail to see or are to cowardly to dig in to "in this particular case"?'
No, I don't think there is anything special about the individuals (again, do not confuse my position with the DB's claims), but I believe that there is something special about the Babylonian Talmud. Have you actually looked at it, Abu? Did you read Jack Bernstein, by the way?
Reply from The Daily Bell
So, the question is, are the Rothschilds to be defined as Zionists or "Anglosphere power elites"? Perhaps both.
Hah, in your "earnest inquiries," you left out 'crypto Jews!"
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 10:13 AM
Interesting... Perhaps this explains DB's sudden obsession with the Zionist theme this week?
Click to view link
"FauxCapitalist:
The day someone posted my article on Click to view link, I see that someone at Click to view link came across my article in doing a search for referring sites, and on that day and the next, they posted the following articles, directly related to the editorial take of the person who posted my article.
Is Zionism an Elite Promotion:
Click to view link
The Jews are At Fault and Israel Is in Charge:
Click to view link
Here is the link on Click to view link:
Click to view link
Reply from The Daily Bell
Sure ... we don't make our own editorial decisions. Decades of research, in aggregate, determined by someone else's commentary!
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 10:00 AM
DB: "He knows this well; he is simply a racist and while we tolerate his equivocations we do not endorse them and in fact are happy (to a degree) to have him make his arguments as he exposes his incipient prejudice with every post in our view."
OK, DB, I thought we both agreed to give this thread a rest, but I see that you keep insulting me when replying to other feedbackers. You think that the insults will prove your point, perhaps?
Let's see what other people on the 'Net think about the Daily Bell position with regard to Zionism on the FauxCapitalist blog:
Click to view link
'FauxCapitalist:
The issue I have with the Daily Bell talking about an 'Anglo-American establishment' is that it is highly deceptive. The reference is to Carroll Quigley's book, The Anglo-American Establishment, but if you're going to make an issue of the nationality and ethnic origin of those who are disproportionately behind the NWO, then I think it's intellectually dishonest to say Anglo-American while concealing the highly disproportionate Jewish element in the Anglo-American contingent of the NWO.
Beyond that, the NWO is internationalist, as demonstrated by 'American' David Rockefeller's Trilateral Commission, with members from Europe, the U.S. and Asia, who are very much all part of his globalist plans 'working against the best interests of the United States.' '
Very similar to what I said several times, and no, I have no association with the FauxCapitalist blog.
Reply from The Daily Bell
Really. We have denied the reality of Jewish involvement? We've called the larger conspiracy a Jewish Cartel/Mafia. And you ... you are scraping the bottom of the barrel.
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Posted by Abu Aardvark on 11/04/11 08:32 AM
"I will modestly point out that DB, in its relentless promotion of Zionism as a modern "Anglosphere power elite" meme, is definitely not acting as a truthseeker in this particular case"
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memehunter, on November 2nd, 1917, it has been made crystal clear to anyone who cares to take notice that contemporary Zionism IS indeed a Anglosphere power elite meme:
Click to view link
Agreed?
Second, a fanatic contemporary Zionist may be dead wrong and, in fact, harmful to his actual cause - the overall well-being of (mostly fellow) Jews in a secure homeland - however, due to being brainwashed form early age on, he may be, at the same time, totally unaware of being used to further a conspiracy that uses Zionism as a TOOL just like it uses central banking, statism or war. Hence my assessment that the overwhelming majority of contemporary Zionists is NOT to be blamed for the damage done in the name of Zionism. Heck, you don't blame fellow countrymen as co-conspirators for believing and participating in "democracy", although you know that it is a damaging fraud and part of the overall ponzi.
Agreed?
Third, I read each and every feedback in these threads of late and still could not identify YOUR ACTUAL POINT. Look, when you write sentences like ...
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"the DB has got it wrong with respect to Zionism. It is actually insulting, from a real truthseeker's position (no, you don't seem to be there yet... ), to claim that Zionism is merely a modern "Anglosphere power elite" promotion. It is an assertion that it ridiculous on its face and rightly deserves to be condemned, even if I am the only one who has the courage to do it on this particular website. "
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... I think it would be helpful if you would start to name names and list facts. Put another way: WHOM, exactly, do you accuse of WHAT, exactly? So far you haven't done that - while posting scores of hints and insinuations.
Agreed?
Or is it that you embrace the notion that there's INDEED something "special" about Jews and/or Zionists, besides serving as just another (rather important, admittedly) elite-tool, that others, not so "courageous" contemporaries, fail to see or are to cowardly to dig in to "in this particular case"?
Reply from The Daily Bell
Ha, a letter. In black and white.
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Posted by taxesbyanyothername on 11/04/11 07:55 AM
Food fight.
Reply from The Daily Bell
Respectully, we disagree. This sort of incipient racism is increasing everywhere on the Internet among the alternative media, and it is devaluing the content and credibility of those who employ it. Zionism is an ideology activated by MERCANTILISM like any other power elite "ism." There was nothing effective about communism before it was linked to a state, nor Nazi-ism.
Yes, we have our own resident racist, but that does not degrade the meme itself, unfortunately. And it is an important point. Zionism means "Jew" to most people. When you speak of "filthy Zionists," you are speaking of filthy Jews. One does not speak of the filthy Mafia and have it translated as "filthy Italians."
Honestly there is a difference. He knows this well; he is simply a racist and while we tolerate his equivocations we do not endorse them and in fact are happy (to a degree) to have him make his arguments as he exposes his incipient prejudice with every post in our view.
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Posted by provolone on 11/04/11 07:16 AM
When I review a discussion like this I get a sense that some of the participants have invested imaginary egotistical capital. We all have a tendency to devolve to this level after a heated debate. Rarely do the Click to view link's discussions fall into this trap, as there is frequently a consensus. As a somewhat objective reader who does not feel he has invested any egotistical capital; Those who can admit fault carry more weight in my eyes. Personally, I enjoy being shown errors in my views as it furthers my understanding of whatever topic is at hand. When exchanges lack this kind of authenticity it appears to be a contest to prove the human adversary wrong. If we are to honestly engage in a debate seeking truth, the only adversary should be false information.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 05:42 AM
DB: You are getting crazy again. Eight feedbacks in a row. Let's give this thread a rest, eh? You've made your "points."
Eh, fine with me. I would not need to reply all the time if the DB did not reply to practically every feedback (even those addressed to other feedbackers), and I would not need to constantly restate my position if it was not constantly distorted. So, we're pretty even on that score.
Readers can see for themselves DB's lengthy feedbacks to my comments. And, if I am "obsessed", this seems to be shared by DB with three articles on the topic this week.
Let's agree to disagree, then, but no need to call me "crazy" or a "racist". This actually does nothing to enhance the level of the debate. Why are insults necessary? You believe you are right, and I do not buy your viewpoint on this particular topic. End of story.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 04:11 AM
DB: "You are not a truth-seeker."
I will modestly point out that DB, in its relentless promotion of Zionism as a modern "Anglosphere power elite" meme, is definitely not acting as a truthseeker in this particular case (note that I am not criticizing DB's efforts in general, but with respect to this particular topic).
Reply from The Daily Bell
You are getting crazy again. Eight feedbacks in a row. Let's give this thread a rest, eh? You've made your "points."
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 04:09 AM
DB: "You are not a truth-seeker. You are a racist."
Aha, now the cat comes out of the bag. Finally.
So, which "race" exactly are you talking about?
Khazars? Ashkenazim? Sephardim? And, what about those Christian Zionists?
Care to be more specific?
Reply from The Daily Bell
Yes. Sigh. We are speaking of your PSYCHOLOGY.
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 03:54 AM
Please be careful, you are being dangerously close to labeling me a "racist" which is not only false but a case of "libel" (pseudonym or not).
DB: What facts? Zionism is an ideology that describes "Jews" who desire a theocratic homeland. But for you "Zionists" (Jews) are behind everything from the Russian Revolution to World War II. ZIONIST JEWS. Not some Jews. Not Jews and others who are "not Jews." Just JEWS. Jews who believe in Zionism. JEWS. It is ridiculous.
M: Still no facts. What a weak reply. Also, I wrote that there were non-Zionist Jews and non-Jew Zionists (as Ms. Rajiva did). Again, DB knows this, but misrepresents my position. Why?
DB: We've written a book about these issues. Took years. Nothing you've written is a revelation to us.
M: Good for you. Is that supposed to make me feel bad?
DB: You may be partially Jewish, but that doesn't give you a free-pass when it comes to being racist.
M: Keep repeating the same lies, hoping that it sticks, eh? I write about an ideology. I will say it clearly (for the umpteenth time): Talmudism/Pharisaism/Zionism is a dangerous ideology, regardless of the ethnicity of its practictioners. Is that clear enough (probably not)?
DB: You were the one who cited Rajiva and now when she writes she has no truck with your position, you suddenly decide her agreement is not important. Ridiculous.
M: Should I repost what Ms. Rajiva wrote? This seems necessary.
"The more interesting question is why the Bell is constantly REWRITING LANGUAGE this way
Zionism X anti-Semitism
No.
Semitic supremacism or philo-Semiticism X anti-Semitism
Zionism X Anti-Zionism
Now is this just a mistake? Is the Bell, dealing with European law, just being careful?
Or, which I would be bitterly disappointed to find out, is this evidence of something else?"
DB: We believe we know what's going on. A power elite that consists of numerous different groups based initially in Britain and now based primarily in Britain, America, Israel and Rome (Western, in other words) has launched a takeover of the world. For you this translates somehow into ZIONISM. OK, fine. You have your paradigm.
M: I don't disagree with you. I'm simply saying that Zionism is part of this power elite, which DB denies (it claims that it is simply a promotion).
Reply from The Daily Bell
Please be careful, you are being dangerously close to labeling me a "racist" which is not only false but a case of "libel" (pseudonym or not).
DB: At least you have word right this time. But you will have a hard time in court proving that we have libeled someone called "Memehunter." A libel must be malicious and false, to begin with - and injurious to someBODY'S public reputation. Memehunter, a pseudonym does not have a public reputation. You can simply discard the name and come in under something else. We have not been malicious but have responded endlessly to your endless thread-clogging rebuttals. It is enlightening and sad, however, that you resort to threatening us under your pseudonym. That certainly says something doesn't it?
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M: What facts? Zionism is an ideology that describes "Jews" who desire a theocratic homeland. But for you "Zionists" (Jews) are behind everything from the Russian Revolution to World War II. ZIONIST JEWS. Not some Jews. Not Jews and others who are "not Jews." Just JEWS. Jews who believe in Zionism. JEWS. It is ridiculous. Still no facts. What a weak reply. Also, I wrote that there were non-Zionist Jews and non-Jew Zionists (as Ms. Rajiva did). Again, DB knows this, but misrepresents my position. Why?
DB: It is not a weak position. It is simply the truth. To most people who don't live in your fantasy-land Zionism means Jew.
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We've written a book about these issues. Took years. Nothing you've written is a revelation to us. M: Good for you. Is that supposed to make me feel bad?
DB: Your endless imputations that you are enlightening us are wearying.
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You may be partially Jewish, but that doesn't give you a free-pass when it comes to being racist. Me: Keep repeating the same lies, hoping that it sticks, eh? I write about an ideology. I will say it clearly (for the umpteenth time): Talmudism/Pharisaism/Zionism is a dangerous ideology, regardless of the ethnicity of its practictioners. Is that clear enough (probably not)?
DB: Good god! A dangerous ideology! You are a sad case. Do you want to BAN this ideology. Zionism is an ideology activated by MERCANTILISM like any other power elite "ism." There was nothing effective about communism before it was linked to a state, nor Nazi-ism. People like you are attacking "Jews" (using a code word) when they should be attacking the system of MERCANTILISM and its statist activating mechanism. But instead you want to blame a religion. Communism and Nazism became destructive when they were linked to a state, not because Hitler wrote Mein Kampf.
You have embarked on an endless rant (which you do not consider racist for some reason), writing something like 100-plus posts defending the Zionist meme. Unfortunately, that does not degrade the growing "Zionist" sub-dominant social theme itself - as Lila Rajiva noted, Again, it is an important point. Zionism means "Jew" to most people. When you speak of "filthy Zionists," you are speaking of filthy Jews. One does not speak of the filthy Mafia and have it translated as "filthy Italians."
Honestly there is a difference. The only upside to your equivocations is that as other feedbackers have noted, your arguments expose your incipient prejudice with every post. In fact, you have accused of us of lying regularly, fronting for the Birch Society and generally implying we are a third column for the CIA.
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M: Should I repost what Ms. Rajiva wrote? Or ... is this evidence of something else?"
DB: We are well aware what Ms. Rajiva wrote, and she wrote you a specific email to correct your misperceptions.
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We believe we know what's going on. A power elite that consists of numerous different groups based initially in Britain and now based primarily in Britain, America, Israel and Rome (Western, in other words) has launched a takeover of the world. For you this translates somehow into ZIONISM. OK, fine. You have your paradigm. .... M: I don't disagree with you. I'm simply saying that Zionism is part of this power elite, which DB denies (it claims that it is simply a promotion).
DB: Zionism is not "part" of a power elite. Zionism is stand-in word for "Jews."
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Posted by memehunter on 11/04/11 03:28 AM
"Unlike you, the DB goes way out of the way to focus on the criminal act, not focusing on individuals, and especially not focusing on an entire race. "... With the triumph of Jewry... " (blacks, rednecks, white boys, slant eyes). The world has had a bad history with collectivism (racism is collectivism). The comment above reeks of collectivism. It's time to move on."
I don't have time to always repeat the same things, and I believe this is a case of willful misunderstanding on your part, but I am pointing fingers at an ideology (Zionism/Talmudism/Pharisaism), not at individuals. You are actually contradicting yourself, because earlier you said I was pointing fingers at an ideology, and now you accuse me of focusing on individuals. What is your point exactly? And, are you sure you understood my point (a good idea before criticizing it... )?
The reason why I write these comments, as I also mentioned earlier, is that I believe that the DB has got it wrong with respect to Zionism. It is actually insulting, from a real truthseeker's position (no, you don't seem to be there yet... ), to claim that Zionism is merely a modern "Anglosphere power elite" promotion. It is an assertion that it ridiculous on its face and rightly deserves to be condemned, even if I am the only one who has the courage to do it on this particular website.
I am not "mad that people don't agree with me" but I will keep defending myself when the DB makes false statements about my positions (somehow you don't seem to disapprove of that, I note - it is OK if the DB distorts my words but it is not OK if I defend myself or if I disagree with them).
Reply from The Daily Bell
The reason why I write these comments, as I also mentioned earlier, is that I believe that the DB has got it wrong with respect to Zionism. It is actually insulting, from a real truthseeker's position
You are not a truth-seeker. You are a racist.
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