I am becoming more and more convinced the elite plan is to simply keep robbing as much as possible and simply let things descend into chaos. I don't think there is an actual plan. Eventually, the sheep of the world will become so hungry, they'll accept anything that puts a little bread on the table.

To the Daily Bell Commentator:

I was referring to Islam even as I referred to Christanity, without the baggage of heresy and schisms. Every religion has a core that signifies its beliefs, it aims and that is what is important when considering it. What the crazies do on the side is of passing interest only.

I have lived with Islam... .five years in the Philippines and Indonesia, three years in Saudi Arabia. I have discussed it logically with its adherents in Jophur, Singapore, Bangkok, Bombay and Karachi and even in Damascus and Bierut, and Cairo. A Prince in Saudi even asked my husband and me to retire in Saudi and the offer was enticing but there was that matter of conversion... it had to be in 3 years. Neither of us could turn our backs on what we were even though we were unchurched.

I AM INTERESTED TO KNOW WHAT YOUR BACKGROUND IS RE iSLAM!

Reply from The Daily Bell

Argh, you are it again. We make a point and then you come back and write something that seems to respond to an entirely different point!

The Daily Bell "commentariat" is usually composed of a dozen elves. When they are on duty they are compelled to sit BENEATH the large conference table so that their chatter will not disturb anyone else. We have no idea of their backgrounds. They come from the earth. The gnomes, we know, come from caves ...

The Anglosphere was chosen by two german intellectuals, to play with their new concepts of society, because it had a free forum of discourse, not available in Germany.

Marx and Engles both spoke english with heavy germanic accents, were not members of the Anglosphere elites. They had some connections but they were on the perphery, not in the heart of it. They were dissidents and sought out others like themselves, many Irish and others from the new Anglo-judaic families anxious to jettison history for a new world and identity.

You might say, it was because of the anglosphere that the new socialists transferred their activities to the USA after WWI, and WWII because the same conditions existed here with the same core to woo!

I suggest you read the bios of all those who had to do with socialism, its exposition. Very good books have been written, with great documentation!
It will be a revelation and should dispel the misinformation you hold to be "self evident".

Reply from The Daily Bell

Nithsdale it is like you are speaking a different language. You will not convince us that the problems of the world stem from communism and socialism. Sorry. Marx and Engles WORKED for the elites. Or Marx anyway. Engels may have had the "connections." Anyway ... socialism, communism, all the "isms" were just so many dominant social themes intended to set people against each other on the way to world government. That's "our" truth after 40 years of investigating this stuff. May not be yours ... Oh, well ...

I think you give them more credit than they deserve. I believe they are more opportunistic and band aid in their approach. I agree they now plan to implode and reset with the IMF et al but I believe this is more in the greater context of expand contract monetize again repeat. You may be correct but I think too many of "We commoners" are onto them for them to pull it off. I think they would have to rely heavily on force and I simply don't think they control that much force. Hmmh?

Here's an article about time running short;

Click to view link

DB: "You too think that "isms" come from the air we breath?"

"ism's" come from the fact that, in general, people are too lazy to think and therefore have a tendency to fall for warm and fuzzy Utopian pipe dreams of "something from nothing" which resolves to "steal from someone else". The manipulators who sell these lies make a substantial commission from their "robbing hood" pretenses and, therefore will not give up their "proceeds of crime without a fight". THINK about it:

Click to view link

Of course, "predators in control", preying on the productive (the only worthy prey) ALWAYS, by their unproductive costs and "tribute" collapse civilization (peaceful division of labor) by defining forceful environments where productivity is both futile (no rewards) and a survival threat (attracts predators).

This is where we are collectively at now. The survival threats of predators in control have forced people to think, as above and, general consensus IS achieved "predators in control". We have gone from fully informed "consent of the governed" to "terror of the governed".

Now, we are collectively concluding that "going along, to get along" leads to more immediate personal survival threats than defiance and "refusal to be prey" which at least offers the possibility of survival.

All because "predators on the bench" have rationalized away the "rule of law" and the peace of "balance of individual power" (equal right to life) just so their foul "profession" can feed from the inevitable conflict and collapse of civilization (peaceful division of labor):

Click to view link

NOW, in fact, any time is not a time for cowardice...

Supposed to be not, not now.

You are exactly right about markets deciding when a country has gone bankrupt. People trust Japan, constitutionally they can not go to war, the people save at a high rate and much of their exessive government spending has gone into infrastructure projects. Spending on infrastructure will now bring an economy out of a recession as they have so amply proven but it appears not to harm an economy as much as some other spending might. I do not believe any other country will be allowed to amass so much debt/GDP as Japan has.

Opinion of Spain's economic situation is not simply based on their debt, their high unemployment has persisted for many years, it did not begin with the latest downturn and will probably get worse if Spanish bond rates increase as they almost surely will.

Germany is doing ok but inflation is occuring in every country not just in the Eurozone. All of the large economies are slowing and most others as well. Germany can not export much is noone is buying.

Certainly the Union can not be turned on a dime, it is a bureaucratic colosus sinking in the mud. Those who want the Union to persist will fight hard to keep it intact but those who want to leave may eventually fight harder.
You can trade and make money in almost any economic situation but that is not the same as starting or expanding a business, nearly all of whose timelines for making money are much longer than a traders. All of that money sloshing around will soon be added to without increasing the appatite for risk. You are almost certainly right it will continue for a very, very long time but the longer it lasts the worse it will get.

for the most part, gotta agree with you, nithsdale

Reply from The Daily Bell

Why do you agree with nithsdale? You too think that "isms" come from the air we breath? You too believe that isms are exhaled much as vegetation quietly exhales carbon dioxide? You too believe that the fluffy clouds themselves gently drizzle an ideology on our dermises, one and all?

Apparently, so! For you, as for nithsdale, history is happenstance, events occur fortuitously, and the hand of God (or fate) guides the lives of mortal men. These are from what we can tell, tales to be told to children at bedtime. You wish to tell them here? OK. But our faces are older, and wrinkly, and trust has fled from our eyes. Sorry.

"I believe that there is very little time to move money and very few places to move it to." Danny B.

You bring to the table some interesting facts, figures and conjectures. The indication that "they" have run out of time is a interesting point of view. The Euro Union's stability has been in question since formation. Your doom and gloom assessment rings true with many. Still the Euro Union continues today. In comparison, Japan should really be bankrupt at current levels of debt. It clearly isn't. Spain with its low levels of sovereign debt shouldn't be in trouble, but clearly is. A remark by Albert Edwards rings true at this point. " A country is bust when the markets decide."

The world has known about Italy's fiscal problems for a generation. Yet it continues. What has changed? In truth not a lot. There are no hard and fast rules as to when a country is bust and certainly not a Union. The Union is comparable to a huge aircraft carrier. You can not turn it on a dime. Nor can you sink it with ease. No, the Union is not going anywhere for the foreseeable future. Even as the Euro declines in value, Germany as an exporting country becomes more competitive in the world market.

The Germans pretend to be upset and disappointed but do not be mistaken. A sluggish and weakened Euro creates a massive advantage for German exports. Germany is the aircraft carrier of the Union. The Germans would be insane to willingly return to a currency that would instantly appreciate and create major damage to their large export industries.

May it happen? It could. Will it happen. It might. But one thing I can successfully depend on, is the fact that the Union is not going anywhere for the foreseeable future. There are too many cards left in the deck to deal. Is the deck stacked? Surely. But that doesn't mean the game stops. There are always willing players to sit in a rigged game. I don't trade on doom and gloom conjectures. A person in my business can lose a lot of money on such conjectures. I trade on change. And the Union is simply changing.

It is a fallacy to believe there is a shortage of money in the world today, there is actually a lot of it sloshing around. What the world lacks is not money but risk appetite and that may very well be a long time in changing. A very long time. Liquidity will become a factor in the Union's change. The ECB has already quietly bought bonds. It's participation will be forced. No sir, there are a lot of cards left in their deck and most of them are up their sleeve and the game will continue. For a very, very long time.

Anglosphere elites are the ones who promoted socialism to enslave the masses. the masses did not do it on their own.

Agreed. This is contrived. Greece has the same population as Ohio. So a state as big as Ohio runs up so much debt it causes the collapse of a union bigger than the United States/

Richard Kelly Hoskins who wrote War Cycles Peace Cycles documents that this debt/bust cycle goes back 4,000 years and the last stage always calls for immigration of people who have clean balance sheets and then war to try to keep it all going.
This whole fiat credit money system has to be swept away and the damn countries need to stop borrowing from banks and elite fronts who then end up in control demanding what to do.

Austerity should be imposed on the elites. They have the wealth to wipe out the debt. And if they don't have enough, then just have a year of jubilee for the balance. And change our ways.

T

EFSM:

Click to view link

@ inujuni "They need time. Time to move wealth."
I believe that "they" are VERY short of time. Here are a few general facts.

In the U.S. credit grew at 6 times the rate that the GDP grew.
Because of history and credit growth, the U.S. has a bond market that is WAY outsize for it's GDP.

The U.S. has 5 times the amount of retail space per person that France has.
Italy is the tenth largest economy in the world but the THIRD largest bond market.
Our retail space is somewhat analogous to our bond market. This unbalance is similar to Italy.
The world GDP is roughly $ 50 trillion. The nominal value of all contracts denominated in dollars is $ 10 quadrillion [old number]. The nominal value of outstanding derivatives is between $ 1---1.5 quadrillion.

Just as the retail industry must crash for lack of consumer purchasing power,,,, the debt service costs for an outsized bond market will rapidly crash the profitability of the [relatively] small producing sector.

The paper market is like the ghost of Voldemort. It's circling the world looking for something to give it substance.
It touches down in gold, commodities, emerging markets, energy. It can't really find substance in any of these areas. It is too big. There is already a flight from the Euro. This will cause even more flights. Where can all the money go?

Since Greek debt got a major haircut without triggering a default to trigger the payout of the underlying CDSs,,, the markets are now notified that CDSs can't be expected to pay off in the future. This will serve to drive up interest rates even faster.
Italy will remember 6% as the gold old days.

Should the same attitude and same contagion permeate the U.S. bond market, the FED will not be able to keep interest rates down. There was recently an exodus by CBs from U.S. debt. It has apparently reversed. There is also an indication that the FED is running short of money.
Click to view link
I believe that there is very little time to move money and very few places to move it to.

Thanks ... interesting !

I suspect that the goal is simple. Manipulate so that Euro's can be printed, essentially the same as what is occurring in the US. The monetary elite's goal: Skim off 25%, purchase hard assets; wait for price inflation to increase the price of the newly inflated assets, pay off the loans and keep remaining assets which could now we free-ride tickets, thus increasing the elite's wealth by 50-80%+.

It has happened over and over again historically, for instance the Civil War inflation, the Weimar Republic hyperinflation, the Assignat Era.

But rather look to these ancient times let's look to more recent times.

Many believe that Max Shapiro's book: The Penniless Billionaires is all about the Weimar Republic, and other long gone historic eras, but it really isn't. The book is not readily available; in fact it's pretty darn hard to find a copy even in libraries, many have oddly disappeared. You can find a readable copy on Click to view link or Click to view link today for only $40-$50 though I am surprised, several months they were selling for over $100. I suspect sellers are searching hard for copies and there is an army of "pickers" in the old book business.

Why hasn't this book been republished--it'd sell a huge amount of copies? My take is simple, someone does not want people reading the last few chapters.
Shapiro explains that in 1963 the total wealth of the top 1% was $548.3 billion. "But during the next ten years (1963-1972) of escalating inflation the super rich (the top 1%) succeeded in amassing one half trillion dollars of additional wealth." I've added items between parentheses.

Looking at the top 1/2 of 1% over one decade, their wealth increased by over 70%.

M2 increased from $174 billion in 1953 to $664 billion in 1975. But here is the telling sentence: "At the end of 1975 the top one percenters had been able to secure an amount of loans that equaled 25% of the entire money supply outstanding."

By 1979 M2 was close to one 953 billion. 1978 and 1979 allowed manufacturers to increase prices even in the face of underlying stable costs. The increase in M2 along with price inflation "enabled strategically situated corporations to hike prices repeatedly, even when goods were in ample supply."

Shapiro looks at past inflationary eras, the Roman, French, Civil War and Weimar Republic. Interestingly most inflationary eras were preceded by a war; though perhaps more instructive to today's scenario France's inflationary era was preceded by the "threat of national bankruptcy and revolution.

So today, edging to a scenario where the European Union can truly attempt to "print its way out of the disaster" seems to me to be bringing everything into alignment with America's tactics. How much of America's stimulus has ended up in the hands of the top 1/2 of one percent? Considering that the Fed gave distributors of funds "waiver's of conflict of interest," I think the answer is apparent.

Maxfield's final chapter: "The Summing Up: The Edge of the Abyss" does sum it up "... were able to pile up assets whose worth rose at a pace higher than inflation--assets that would retain their value long after the inflation had run its course."

Why he doesn't come out and say each Era was a conspiracy? He does though not so bluntly, looking back, my take is that in fact each of these episodes were in some ways conspiratorial.

Eventually the plan must be to set up Europe to be able to print its way out of the immediate crisis. This of course sets the stage for inflation, and the top 1/2% will be there skimming off 25% of the money supply, buying assets, and riding a new wave of wealth transfer, paying off the loans with depreciated currency.

I highly recommend finding a copy of this amazingly well written book if you can. But remember, the elite is doing its best to make it difficult to find.

Oops, another conspiracy theory...

Socialism has bankrupted the Western World and its trading partners and you are ranting on about the anglosphere eltes.

Western leaders are exiting their powers (resigning) as quickly as possible since no one wants to cut, maybe even shut the payments to millions of people who expect them every month, on schedule in order to live. All are having nightmares regarding what may happen to them after what happened to Quadhaffi in Libya and there are those pictures of Mussolini hanging upside down still displayed in Italisn "journalism" and you are talking still about the elites wanting control of the world!

Our world is collapsing and all the military in existence cannot stem the problems that come with civilizations outliving their usefulness. You are seeing that play out with small occupiers and the police in every place they have met. You keep thinking it is a plot, but it is reality. Government cannot give any more to its people because most of its people are no longer working, producing anything but hot air and strange theories as to why governments can't produce and give them more!

You keep harping on redistribution of wealth, how it went wrong, so it must be the elites since they built the system that made it all possible! You assert that they want to bring it down so they can build another one, this time fabricated from more intense study! This time it will be applied to everyone in the world, regardless of their status, educated, cultured or not! Dream on for that is what you are - dreamers forged from the same kind of nonsense made so popular in the Harry Potter series. It would be great to inhabit two different worlds, one allowing special passes for believers when they want to escape the real one they were born to!

You are right in saying there has to be a great conspiracy but you have tagged the wrong conspirators. The Age of Christianity was a conspiracy and gave us our World but it has outlived its promotion. Christian charity has been extended to all and lo, we are all "retired" from work now, the aged, the infirm, the "gifted" and the youth all so well educated they can't work, only play games! Since the worker bees have all been converted to butterflies and their mentors, their sires to WASPS or wantabes, (the Anglosphere you refer to constantly), it appears they must give way for some new Savior! And you are right! It is time that the Judaic/Christians depart and soon. The Anno Domini crowd, those jews and christians, fronted by a portrait of a young intellectual with healing eyes and hands, who worked together for 2,000 years to give us this dreadful world, have to get out! You will get your wish. Even now, they are leaving, most by death, the end of normal life; 80 millions are due to pass "over" within the next 25 years! Then, your generation will own it all and have its wish. The problem is: do any of you know what you own?

There is another conspiracy waiting in the wings for this world of ours to fall. For a thousand years they have made it known they are different and they hate anyone who does not agree with them. You have been educated to hate anyone who does not agreee with you, assail them, mock them. You will be perfect partners for what is to come! However, I suggest you start learning from a great French Epee master, how to parry the sword. You see these people who you agree with intellectually, have been "parrying" with the West so long that some elites have learned their style. The French have kept it a fashion!

Reply from The Daily Bell

There is another conspiracy waiting in the wings for this world of ours to fall. For a thousand years they have made it known they are different and they hate anyone who does not agree with them.

Go ahead and "assail" Sunni Islam, Nithsdale. Good for you ...

All your articles today look good,DB.

Basically what we see here is the use of the tactic of 'create a problem, propose a solution.'

This entire financial meltdown scenario is a created 'problem' ripe for the globalist 'solution' -- as you say. A set-up.

So easy to create financial problems, meltdowns, recessions, inflations, when you have Rothschild central banks installed in most countries in the world - all except No. Korea, Iran, and Cuba, according to what I just read in an article I found on Click to view link

I have been realizing more fully the extent to which the average person, and even a lot of very intelligent people, rely on others - 'experts' - to do their thinking for them.

And so many issues in the modern world are so easy to 'complexify'- none more so than economics.

Ah, the Internet Reformation

According to Pareto who thought the world could be divided into two main types of people, wrote in French, the SPECULATOR and the RENTIER. The speculator being the one who reconstructs and manipulates the rentier, or the stockholder.

The elites (speculators) throughout history and even today, have been considered the great investors, politicians and traders of the world, when in fact, they are simply manipulators. When the elite travels out of his manipulative state and attempts to legitimately invest or trade, it is normally followed by an implosion and the destruction of legitimate wealth. Case in point, the implosion of MF Global and Long Term Capital Management.

The coming implosion of Greece and perhaps the Euro-Union is no different. Instead of the elites straying out of their manipulative zone they are finding out that the internet is becoming a truth serum that is hard to swallow. The internet has created the ability to access information that was once privy to only the manipulator. But more importantly it has created the ability to ACT on that information. The RENTIERS for the first time in history, have the ability to form a hypothesis and go out in the world and submit it for immediate feedback. In this case, moving money at the speed of light. The manipulator needs time to digest what has happened.

That is why the Greece bail-out and the Euro-Union will continue. At least for the foreseeable future. They need time. Time to move wealth. Time to reconstruct and time to reconsider how to begin the manipulation of the internet, either by new regulations, laws and or banking controls. Some of which we see in play today.

The successful Chinese model of internet suppression may be the case study. Certainly the manipulative reconstruction attempts for suppression will have a Chinese tone to them. Until then, the rats are jumping ship and moving money around, creating hot zones in other countries. The fallout? The devaluation of currencies. All currencies. It is happening as I watch my trading screens and type.

Reply from The Daily Bell

Very good. Subtle. Interesting. Thanks

Talking about "Der "Spiegel" - This rather odd interview with Syrian Grand Mufti Sheikh Hassoun is from todays international section:

Hassoun: In March, there was a completely justified, peaceful rally in Daraa against the governor of the region, who had thrown schoolchildren into prison. Daraa is a town near the Jordanian border known for smuggling. I went there right away and brought calm to the situation, and I promised the people an independent investigation. At my suggestion, the president removed the governor from office. But then imams who had come from abroad, especially Saudi Arabia, stirred things up with their inflammatory speeches. The news channels stationed in the Gulf states, Al-Jazeera and Al-Arabiya, helped them by falsely claiming that the clergy was on the side of the anti-Assad protesters.

SPIEGEL: Are you saying that the uprising against Assad was not triggered by regime repression but is being controlled from abroad?

Hassoun: Look at the second center of unrest, next to Daraa: Homs. That city is also very close to the border, in this case with Lebanon. Unpleasant elements -- Iraqis, Afghans, Saudis and Yemenis -- have also come from there, all with a radical, fundamentalist agenda. The provocateurs even attacked police chiefs and military officers in their homes.

SPIEGEL: It sounds like a conspiracy theory, with which you are trying to gloss over the failure of the Assad regime.

Hassoun: The government is not as you describe it. But it has made political and economic mistakes and did not liberalize quickly and comprehensively enough. The president is taking responsibility for that.

(... )

SPIEGEL: At the moment, however, he has been very hesitant in agreeing to reforms. Under massive pressure from the Arab League, he agreed to end the violence within the next two weeks. Did Assad underestimate the scope of revolutionary change in the Middle East? Did you, too, fail to anticipate that the region's authoritarian rulers could be swept away?

Hassoun: Oh, the Arab League and the so-called Arab Spring. In my opinion, the League is deeply divided, into a wing that sees itself primarily in opposition to Israel, and another one that positions itself against supposed Iranian dominance. Since the League is so concerned about Syria, where is its outcry over Yemen and Bahrain, where the conditions are much worse? And what has really improved in Egypt? Should we welcome the rise of Islamist parties? I believe in the strict separation of church and state.

SPIEGEL: NOT ALL ISLAMISTS ARE ENEMIES OF DEMOCRACY (Emphasis added by me) The winners of the election in Tunis have committed themselves to pluralism, and the Justice and Development Party (AKP) in Ankara largely practices this pluralism.

Click to view link

Reply from The Daily Bell

This is really great stuff. Thanks much. Sorta confirms our sentiments ....