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Soros: EU May Collapse

Friday, April 16, 2010 – by Staff Report

George Soros

Soros: Euro, EU Will Collapse if Germany Doesn't Make Concessions ... Billionaire financier George Soros (left) thinks the euro and the European Union itself are at risk of breaking up if Germany refuses to play its traditional role and make concessions, he told a newspaper. "The Germans have always made the concessions needed to advance the European Union, when people were looking for a deal. Not anymore," Soros told Corriere della Sera in an interview published on Thursday. "That's why the European project is stalled. And if it can't go ahead from here, it will go backwards. It's important to understand that if you don't make the next steps forward for the euro, the euro will go to pieces and the European Union, too," he said. Soros, who is speaking at a variety of events in Italy this week, said whereas in the past there had been the political will to go forward, "now there's a lot of doubt that it is there." He said the EU needs a more flexible mechanism on deficit cuts so that countries do not have to cut public spending so drastically. – MoneyNews

Dominant Social Theme: It is a worrisome time.

Free-Market Analysis: Are you an investor? You are probably concerned about the EU, or at least aware of how the worldwide economic crisis is affecting it. If the EU breaks apart, the impact would be global. The dollar would probably benefit – at least initially. Gold and silver would likely rise as well. And individual European countries would have much different outlooks than they do now, some better, some worse. The undoing of the EU would also have large impacts on other currency unions and, in fact, would cause people to question the dominant social theme of the past half century which has been "globalization" – the harmonization of rules, regulations and "free trade" agreements throughout the world.

The stakes are high. What is at risk is the believability of the globalization meme, on which the power elite has staked so much. More than almost any other promotion, the inevitability of "globalization" is necessary if the elite is to continue to combine countries into currency regions and tear down barriers between nation states. Thanks to the economic crisis and the education about monetary issues provided by the Internet, the grand EU experiment seems as likely to founder as prosper.

In Germany, a group of anti-EU professors is suing over the Greece bailout. The professors claim it's unconstitutional. How would a bust-up occur? There are various scenarios. In the UK Telegraph, uber-reporter Ambrose Evans-Pritchard believes that a German court could do the trick by declaring Germany's bailout cooperation unconstitutional. He writes as follows:

... This court challenge over Greece may bring long-bubbling, long-suppressed tensions into the open. It clearly poses risks that the media, markets, and South Europeans have failed to understand. Most appear to think that Chancellor Angela Merkel is being truculent because of the North Rhine-Westphalia elections on May 9. This presumption reveals more about them, and the legal-political cultures they come from, than it does about German affairs.

The German passion for sound money is not just the result of hyper-inflation in 1947-1948 and 1923. It stems from the deeper intuition that sound money and democratic freedom are inter-linked. Monetary disorder bled Weimar of legitimacy. Of course, this complaint threatens to unleash havoc in all kinds of ways. "This may cause a great crisis in Europe but we already have a crisis," said Dr Karl Albrecht Schachtschneider, law professor at Nuremberg University and author of the complaint, when we chatted yesterday.

He will ask for an injunction to freeze all aid for Greece while the case is pending, which may take weeks or months. How will the Court rule? The breach of the no bail-out clause of Article 125 of the Treaties is so clear that it will be very hard to finesse. "It is a question of law – the duty of the court to defend the German constitution. They have no choice other than reaching a lawful decision," he said. His fellow Musketeer, Professor Wilhem Hankel from Frankfurt University, is more sceptical, telling me that the Verfassungsgericht is a "political court" that will try to wriggle out of a hot issue. He said a clear ruling that prohibits the bail-out is "unlikely", but the political fall-out will be great whatever happens.

We have a hard time believing that any German court would render an absolutist verdict in this case. The idea that a few men in robes would unravel – or be allowed to unravel – the EU "experiment" doesn't make much sense to us. Of course maybe it could happen, but we are more apt to believe that entropy will have its way. Ultimately, the EU will fail, if it fails, because people simply will have had enough. It may not be a court case, a political decision, even a stated abrogation. It may be simply be an evolution of frustration, disappointment and disenchantment with the concept itself.

Sometimes empires decline without sound and fury, without thunderous crashes and great declamations. Perhaps, people simply weary of the taxes and endless, manipulative warring. They may finally come to the conclusion that the Gods have not after all blessed their nation state more forcefully than another. They may simply decide that the oppression of the government is not worth the benefits of safety and stability. Here's what we wrote back in January 2010:

Endless History channel programs debate the rise and fall of [Central and] South American societies – the Mayan, Aztec, Inca, etc. We would argue that the rise of these societies had much to do with the little city-states that proceeded empire. Once a tyrant arose and conquered the city-states around him (or her in some cases) empire was established and the very thing that had enriched the culture and created the civilization – the ability of people to get away from oppressive government – was lost.

Of course, modern, mainstream analysis doesn't see it that way. The greatness of these cultures, the History channel has determined, arises from empire itself. In fact, the aggregation of power and the assumption of empire spells the end of the civilization not the beginning. Yes, the History channel has it backwards – but that's OK. National Geographic et al. love nothing more than prattling on about kings and queens and heirs and dynasties. It makes for colorful viewing but from our perspective, what they perceive as the greatness of leadership is actually the slow-motion descent into totalitarianism and rapine.

In fact, there is a theory that we have pointed out in these pages before (well, we try to point out it regularly) that many of the "glorious" dynasties of South and Central America came to an end because people simply couldn't stand the endless warfare and blood-letting. These were very bloodthirsty regimes apparently and getting your heart cut out while you were still alive was not a pleasant way to die.

... The demise of some of these empires (and it appears to be a cyclical pattern) may be more mundane. People simply melted back into the jungle when they couldn't take it anymore. Perhaps their societies had been partially destroyed by the endless wars. Certainly, nobody wants to live in a society that emphasizes constant warfare. So as these empires became ever greater and more powerful, they also became ever more horrible places to live in. They sowed the seeds of their own destruction. People finally just wanted to get away.

To read more, Click Here.

We think this is how the EU may end, not with a bang but with a whimper. Right now the European elite is fighting hard to prevent a break up and set new sociopolitical power precedents about what Brussels can do to supersede national rule. But we have a hard time believing that Brussels will simply be able to legislate itself into a position of power vis-à-vis the whole of Europe.

Conclusion: When times were good, Brussels could pass most any law or regulatory procedure it wanted. But that is much different than legislating frugality, higher taxes, reduced pensions, etc. In the latter cases, we believe Brussels would be first ignored and then confronted. There is no way that the entire European paraphernalia of "social justice" is to be dismantled at Brussel's whim. More likely, the various states of Europe are apt to go their own way for their own reasons. There will probably be a series of announcements, were this to occur, affirming the inviolability of the EU and the sacredness of its unity. And then countries would leave.




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Effective April 25, 2012, the Daily Bell will discontinue allowing feedback comments. We have left in place the large body of responses posted in the past, as we appreciate the valuable contributions made by some of our readers.
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  Posted by Phil on 03/29/11 11:56 AM

joe you morn most of the EU is secular its self why the hell would it impose relgious values on a country that is already 50/50. the east side of turkey is fanatic muslim its only the western side that tolerates multiculturalism and freedoms that the east simply does not follow. it seems that the american government want the EU to succeed it will have a huge ally against the other super countries.
the EU will probably collapse into a smaller more managable state. but lets be honest the transition was rushed when really they should have planned it by making anyone who is a member more contributory to it. the UK still run its self completely. and are even breaking away from the EU. many countries were not ready for the economic stability that is the EU spain greece portugal are all suffering from this. there economy was not ready for this. they already had problems, and had hope that the EU would be able to change that, unfortunately there economies are not strong enough at present and by joining have made it even worse the only ones that seem to benefit from this is belgium, france, italy and Germany despite what people are saying these countries seem to be benefiting quite alot from compared with their neighbouring countries.
the only way an effective EU will develop properly is with prudent planning and a gradual change rather than one that takes only a few years for a country to be signed up :/ just doesnt work that way espcially when there are big enough groups in the country which can create instabilty.

the EU isnt evil at all. EVIL is organised. the leaders of the EU are running round like headless chickens id rather say they are in a chaotic phase which is worse than evil considering the damage it does :/

  Posted by Joe on 03/20/11 05:21 PM

I seriously hope the evil EU falls! I would seriously dance and celebrate when the EU totally collapses! I am an American who happens to be of Turkish origin and the EU is plotting to destroy Turkey and they want to ruin the progressive secular system created by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk in Turkey and replace it was a religious fundamentalist Oligarchy where womans rights and human rights are violated. They hypocritically pout about Turkey and people in EU countries go to jail because they disagree about the labels of certain events in history. I will be literally jumping in joy if the EU is dead. The EU empire is as evil as Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union and I will laugh if Merkel or Sarkozy dies of a heart attack too.

  Posted by PabloHoney on 12/02/10 03:49 AM

The E.U. was a bad idea from the get-go and now you are seeing why. You have also seen/will see many countries lose their national identity to this "union." Also whenever Mr.Soros has anything to say, it's to his own benefit in the end.

  Posted by Michael Berkemeier on 07/19/10 03:29 AM

It has already been conceived of in order to discuss it. Attention is focussed on US to bail out the smaller nations, but have you looked at our own debt situation, which is almost as bad as France and worse than UK. It is not just a matter of constitution, but ability to afford.

Reply from The Daily Bell

Agreed. But a breakup of the EU would be a heavy burden indeed for an elite that has invested so much time and money into building it as a steppingstone toward more global governance.

  Posted by Evan Vasiliades on 05/21/10 01:40 PM

Soros is one of the most intelligent voices in the financial markets. Soros is currently long on AT&T Corporation and Citigroup Inc., two companies that I believe are undervalued and will increase in value overtime. The question that remains is how will the European Union prevent Member States from pursuing persistent fiscal deficits at the expense of other Member States?

Reply from The Daily Bell

Geez, Evan, we are complimented by your visit and your feedback. But you DO realize you are not "preaching to the choir" here at the Bell (at least not in our humble opinion if we understand our readership correctly).

  Posted by JIMNYC on 04/20/10 07:12 AM

George Soros is part of the troublemakers trying to rule the world. This is an indirect discreet threat from him and his cronies. Their empire is collapsing so be prepared for them to do something mean and drastic to draw attention away from their empire collapse. THEY ARE EVIL

Reply from The Daily Bell

So it was a warning, but a "different kind" of warning. Hm-mm.

  Posted by Onsite Repair on 04/19/10 04:55 AM

Soros is one of the speakers of Esperanto, a native speaker in fact and I think it is the new living language mentionedon the Georgia Guidestones. If so that puts his game plan on the table for all to see.Also it confirms the whole Gaia/mother earth religion tie in.I love nature, but Agenda 21 is not the answer and neither is killing off 95 of the human race.

  Posted by Tom on 04/18/10 10:10 PM

Excellent, very rare commentary. Most people will starve very soon.

  Posted by Evil Twin on 04/17/10 03:17 PM

Thank God, this rotten Proto-USSR will come to a timely, yet sudden collapse. To hell with the EURO, long live the Deutschmark!

  Posted by Pearl Little on 04/17/10 03:28 AM

The description of the fall of the S. American empires sounds far more like the USA than Europe. To be sure, some of the Europeans including the Germans are engaging, with small contingents in the endless US wars and bloodletting, but it cannot be compared with the massive amount of money and human lives involved in US war-making.

For the average German, the crisis seems pretty far removed from daily life. No one is losing their home and few are losing their jobs. Perhaps there is some scepticism in regard to the EU, but it is certainly handy to be able to take your 6 weeks of vacation almost anywhere in Europe without worrying about currency or even passports.

  Posted by Ingo Bischoff on 04/17/10 03:04 AM

In your piece "Are Roman and American Empires good?" which you linked to this opinion, you wrote: "Of course, one can trace exactly the same sort of cultural pattern in America. We would argue that America's greatness was established long before its Constitution and was a direct result of the dispersal of power centers. The Constitution, in fact, as libertarians well know, was a centralizing device. Seen from this point of view, it was ultimately a step backwards not forwards."

I must disagree. The founders were well aware of the points you made. They were careful in designing the Constitution to guard against centralization. They wanted each separate, sovereign State at the table of government in the persons of the Senators appointed by the State legislatures. They wanted each of the States represented in the Senate, not the people. This was to guarantee State independence and to prevent America from becoming an Empire.With the ratification of the 17th Amendment in 1913, the States gave up their voice at the table of government and enabled the Federal Government to centralize decisions and to embark on empire building.How to step back from the empire...???

Repeal the "unconstitutional constitutional" 17th Amendment. Thereafter, repeal the 16th Amendment. This will return the U.S.A. to the American Republic of the original constitution. There will again be competition for people, talent and capital among the fifty sovereign, independent States.

Reply from The Daily Bell

It was a good document in many ways. Though Thomas Jefferson had his doubts, didn't he?

  Posted by Dan on 04/16/10 10:47 PM

Sovereign debt is crashing badly, Why even worry about Greece when Spain is right behind and TOO big. Global wage arbitrage is NOT going to let up. Neither is the slide. It's also a question of self-discipline. The Nordic countries and Germany have it and others don't.

If you expect Greece to become disciplined after the ouzo bottle is refilled, you haven't been to Greece. As the Bell pointed out, if the PIIGS were to magically slash pensions and wages and raise taxes, the resulting lowering of GDP would commensurately lower the tax revenues needed to service the debt. They'll strangle on low tax revenues or they'll strangle on high debt interest but, strangle, they will.

  Posted by Spencer on 04/16/10 01:54 PM

Soros was also overheard talking to his wife:"Yes honey, I know I vowed to honor and cherish, but if you want this marriage to survive, you're just going to have to overlook my carousing and infidelities!"And more seriously, A. Hickey, while size can lead to negotiang strength, that's quite an assumption you seem to make. i.e., that disastrous monetary, fiscal and political policy in the EU and across the world that is leading to the euro/EU failure won't also reduce/negate any negotiaing strength you surmise may remain with the behemouths of China, Sth America and even U.S.A. Aren't we all failing together?(Africa? You're kidding, right? And just how is Sth America a significant unified negotiator?)

  Posted by Kaydell Bowles on 04/16/10 01:40 PM

The German people after their great depression has had conservative values regarding spending and credit and fiscal responsibility. Yes they do care about everyone being equal as to services.

The West German people suffered through the ordeal to make the citizens of Eastern Germany on par with them. Did these nation help out on their need. This being said they do not want to make the sacrifice for those nations that have spent and placed their grand children into debt. Why should they help? I hope the Germans do not bail them out.

This is rewarding bad behavior,George Soros has enough money to help out with all his hedge funds. In doing so he made several countries totter. Maybe he could help out Greece and Spain in a benevolent gesture. Oh I forgot it is all about George and he being the King.

  Posted by Daniel on 04/16/10 01:35 PM

There are a lot of tensions within the EU versus nation state interest that are not recognized, and it is not a done deal that the EU superstate will win over.

Usually there is the need of a war or something galvinizing for an united EU superstate to win. A severe economic crisis is not enough: the EU will not stand the strain and will break apart like the Soviet Union did, and the Soviet Union was far more united than the EU.

Speaking of these EU tensions..the modern masonic-socialist thinking is that tensions are dialectic, and if you position yourself on either side of the EU tension, you always win. So if the EU superstate breaks apart, you will see that this stress that caused the breakup is the same stress that will created supersocialist nationstates. Either way, the collectivists/statists plan to win, either on the EU level or national level. Tensions and crisises are ALWAYS a good chance to grab more power, if not here, then there.

  Posted by AmanfromMars on 04/16/10 10:36 AM

"Soros makes money trading currencies. I wouldn't pay too much attention to whatever he has to say. He doesn't have anyone's best interest at heart - except his own." .....

Posted by Barbara Paolucci on 4/16/2010 9:50:19 AM

What do you imagine his US$ position is ...... Is the vault empty or full?

Reply from The Daily Bell

Yes, he is worth listening to within the larger scheme of things. One doesn't need to take his comments at face value though. Perhaps he is short the euro ... who knows.

  Posted by Barbara Paolucci on 04/16/10 09:50 AM

Soros makes money trading currencies. I wouldn't pay too much attention to whatever he has to say. He doesn't have anyone's best interest at heart - except his own.

  Posted by Bill Ross on 04/16/10 08:52 AM

Soros: "He said the EU needs a more flexible mechanism on deficit cuts so that countries do not have to cut public spending so drastically"

Orwellian deSpin: We need "something from nothing" (another illusion), so we can continue on our present unsustainable course, just a little longer, at far greater ultimate REAL cost.

The grim reaper of "Mathematics of Rule" (reality) is determining outcome and does not give a crap regarding how dissenters may feel about it or who may suffer. Somebody will suffer, elites are attempting to make sure it is not them:

http://www.cli.gs/MathematicsOfRule

  Posted by Ichabod on 04/16/10 08:39 AM

In the midst of the din of elitist perception creation I wonder how many realize the stealth meme of returning America and indeed the world to pre-settlement days is quietly spreading and growing.

It's being fostered by an elite within academia, nonprofits, and government agencies.The meme is based on our need to live in harmony with nature and biological diversity is at the core.

I have attended presentations explaining why it's necessary to control plant species and why laws enforcing what plant is allowed to grow where are needed. The meme includes the rebuilding of cities bringing wildlife back into contact with humans on a daily observable basis. Will that include lions, tigers and bears? OH, my!

The Bell has mentioned Detroit as slated for vast demolition in order to renew it. It's beautiful. The old order out of chaos view but it's more than that. It's part and parcel of the meme.

All brought to you by the state where your place in it will be determined by that same state. Check out

Click to view link for openers.

Read it carefully and you'll see the meme. Those who understand the collectivist world view will be able to predict the structure of programs designed to bring it about.

Reply from The Daily Bell

Very good! The Romans razed Carthage and sowed the land with salt. The elites do the same - to their own countries.

  Posted by Mike on 04/16/10 07:47 AM

The highly contracting atmosphere that is effecting all countries in the world that overspent,over promised,over expanded,over imagined,living on leftovers are finding out that less is more the hard way whether they like it or not.

The game of globalism is just another fraud for deadbeats to live off people that live within their means.Everyone has their cup out saying"me too."

Less resouces in the world with more people equals less for everyone costing Click to view link is time for everyone to get invented finding ways to get more for less or the only"more"they will get is bills.

Tough times are arriving allowing everyone to prove their Click to view linkke it or not you find out who you really are.Shrink things down to what is manageable to you and go from their.

You might find out you have a skill for hunting,fishing and farming which will be considered valued in what it coming our way .Have fun.

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